Tika McLean is Building Community in Art and Every Day

About This Episode:

This week on Stageworthy, Phil Rickaby is joined by the vibrant and multifaceted Tika McLean. In a conversation that is as funny as it is profound, Tika reflects on her journey from a self-described “shy kid” who once froze during a church solo to becoming a bold, multidisciplinary artist who uses her voice to challenge the status quo.

In this episode:

• The “General Creative” Philosophy: Why Tika refuses to choose just one lane between acting, dancing, and painting.
• Art as Social Commentary: Using satire to address racism and the “distraction economy.”
• Navigating the Industry with Disability: The reality of chronic pain, healthcare “sensitivity,” and accessibility on stage.
• The K-Pop Connection: How global fandoms and the South Korean idol system inspired her new musical project.
• And much more!

Guest: 🎭 Tika McLean

Tika McLean is a performer who uses acting, singing, dancing & painting as creative outlets to express her performance abilities to her audience. She created her one woman (for now) production company, Beyond A Productions, and shares her comedy skits, cover songs and dances on her YouTube channel TIKA! (@tikacreates), & LOVES to perform live! Tika strives to build mutual aid networks in her community through her work with various organizations as an outreach worker for people experiencing homelessness, hosting clothing drives and a portable soup kitchen, and handing out Covid fun packages for people in isolation. She continues to volunteer in her community by mentoring youth & young adults to create their own community initiatives & achieve their career goals. She also is the proud creator of GIVE ‘EM LOVE, an art fundraiser platforming communities experiencing oppression due to stigma, to finally have the opportunity to tell their stories to the world. Tika wants you to know that mutual aid networks are key to creating positive change in our communities.

Connect with Tika:

📸 Instagram: @angry_black_womban
🎥 TikTok: @angry_black_woman
📺 YouTube: @TikaCreates

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Transcript

[Phil Rickaby]
Hello, welcome to Stageworthy. I’m Phil Rickaby, the host and producer of this podcast. Stageworthy is Canada’s theatre podcast, and on Stageworthy, I talk to people who make Canadian theatre, from actors to directors to playwrights to stage managers to producers.

If they’re involved in theatre, I’m going to talk to them. Some of the people I talk to are household names, and the rest are people I really think you should get to know. I’m going to tell you about my guest this week, but first, before I do that, a little bit of housekeeping.

I want to talk about my Patreon, because I can’t do this show without the people who have chosen to back me on Patreon. You’re listening to this podcast for free, and there are no ads on this podcast. And the only reason I’m able to even make this is because of my patrons.

Even though you’re listening to this for free, even though I don’t charge you anything, it still costs money to make a podcast. It costs money to have a website, to host the audio files, distribute the audio to all the podcast platforms. It costs money for editing software, image editing software, and also for transcripts, which I’m currently in the process of adding to the back catalogue.

But all the new episodes now have transcripts, and that costs money too. With the patrons I have, who I’m incredibly grateful for, I’m just barely making ends meet as far as the podcast production is concerned. I’m not even paying myself for my time.

And it does take time to do this show. You have to book guests, do research on guests, record the episode, edit the episode, create show notes for the episode, create the transcript, and so many other little tasks that go into making this show. If you find value in Stageworthy, if you would love to be one of the people, if you would like to be one of the people who helps me to make this show, please go to patreon.com/stageworthy and become a patron. Patrons get early access to episodes. We’ll have conversations about some interesting topics around theatre. There’s one topic that I just posted about, about funding models and how they maybe should change.

And that came out of an article that I saw, and I want to have some great conversations like that one on the Patreon. And the more patrons who join, the more I will be able to offer to the patrons. So if you want to be part of that, if you want to be one of the people who helps me to make this podcast, go to patreon.com/stageworthy and become a patron. Stick around to the end of the show when I will tell you about who my guest is next week. And this is an exciting one, so you won’t want to miss that. My guest this week is Tika McLean.

Tika is a performer, actor, dancer, painter, a general creative. I loved getting to know Tika, and you will too. So here’s my conversation with Tika McLean.

Tika McLean, thank you so much for joining me. I really appreciate you giving me some time today to talk about theatre, about you. You’ve described yourself as a performer who uses singing, acting, dancing, and painting as creative outlets.

How did that get started for you? Because you’ve got like a wide variety of things that you do, and I think that artists should always have a wide variety. But some people focus a little bit more, and it’s really exciting that you’re doing so much.

Have you always done all of those things, or did you come to the acceptance of doing all of those things later on?

[Tika McLean]
A mix of both. I’ve always done those things, but I didn’t always do them well. You know, I’ve always been a performing arts type of girly.

I’ve loved the performing arts since I was a little kid, and I would always tell anybody who would ask me, what do you want to do? I’m like, obviously I want to perform. And the reaction I would get would be kind of like, really?

Because I’d get shy. Because I used to be shy at times, and I still can be. And when it comes to going on stage, you have to be confident.

Like there’s a level of, how do I say this? Like pretentiousness that you need to have in order to go on stage and put on a show that people like. So I had to learn over the years, because I started in about grade two with theatre shows, doing musical theatre in elementary school.

And I would just be so shy, I wouldn’t be able to speak. Like I would just freeze on stage. I couldn’t move my face.

My face would just be stiff, and I’d just look like I’m just so mad. But it was just that I’m nervous. I don’t like, I didn’t know what to do.

But there were so many performers that I admired growing up. I would see them go on stage, and I’d be like, how do I make my face do that? How do I make my body do that and look confident?

Because I can do that when I’m behind a closed door by myself. But then to go on stage and do that, like what? And I always found it so funny how people have to, not have to, but basically look a certain way in order to be perceived as an amazing performer.

You have to have a certain way about you, a certain confidence level. And it’s funny because we’re just singing. We’re just dancing.

We’re just acting. But we may be doing something that is helping our community with our art. It’s not like, it’s just, it’s just.

It’s more, it’s like, I don’t know, when somebody is singing a song about, hey, I really like this fruit, or I just love to drink this drink. It’s like, is it really that serious? It’s fun.

And I just felt like I was around a lot of people who were taking things so seriously to the point that it’s not fun anymore. And I’m like, this is serious. It’s a job.

Like this is my career. But at the same time, I don’t want to be so far up my own behind that I don’t remember to have fun with what I’m doing.

[Phil Rickaby]
I think that’s a, that’s a huge, that’s a huge lesson. There are a lot of lessons in there. When I first graduated from theatre school, I kind of did that.

I was too serious. I was like, oh, I won’t, I didn’t go to see blockbusters. Listen, I grew up, I was such a nerd.

I was a comic book nerd, a Star Wars nerd, a Star Trek nerd. I was a nerd. But when I graduated from theatre school, I felt like I wasn’t allowed to do that.

I felt like, no, no, no, I should only see important films. I should only see important theatre and things like that. And man, I was kind of miserable.

Yep. I was missing out on the things that I really loved. And I, you know, I think, I think there is a certain amount of pretentiousness that can come from theatre school because you’re in the, in this bubble, right?

[Tika McLean]
Yeah. It’s like, I fully agree with you. Growing up, I, I really loved musical theatre, but when I would talk with other folks who were in musical theatre, people my age, children at the time, they’re like, I know this musical, this musical, this musical, this musical, this, and I’m like, I don’t know most of those.

And then they look at me like, how are you in musical theatre? But you don’t know this, that, and this, that. Like, I hate Les Mis.

I hate it with a passion. You can’t get me to watch Phantom of the Opera. And yet these are all basic that if you try to have a conversation with me about it, I’m like, you know, I’m good.

I love people like Harry Belafonte when it comes to or Kimbrough who go on stage and they’re having a good time. They’re having fun. They’re engaging the audience.

They’re serious about their art, just like I am. But I also know that I’m not performing heart surgery. Like, you know, music has a, an art has such an emotional effect on people.

And it can, like, for me, when I was dealing with depression and different things like that, I would watch a musical or one of my favourite artists perform on stage and I instantly feel somewhat better. But it’s like a temporary solution to a deeper issue that maybe something like heart surgery or therapy could solve. But I’m not, you know, I’m not a doctor.

I’m just your emotional temporary bandage right now that hopefully you like to listen to and want to perform.

[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. I mean, you were talking about being shy and when you were when you were a kid and I spent a lot of time under the belief that in order to be in this industry, you had to be an extrovert, right? You had to be outgoing and an extrovert.

And for years I said, oh, I’m an extrovert. I’m an extrovert. But every time somebody was like, oh, we’re having a networking party, you want to come out here?

We’re having a party. I’d be like, oh, no, I can’t do that. I’m just kidding.

I would come with some excuse, right? Because I am and have always been an introvert. But I convinced myself that that’s not something you could be.

But over the years, I’ve actually discovered that there are so many introverts in the theatre, in the arts.

[Tika McLean]
Yes, there are so many. Most of the people that I know are introverted. They don’t really socialize with people too much.

And there’s a mix of both for sure. But for sure, I have noticed a lot of introverts. And for me, I’m I don’t remember what they call omnivore ambivert.

I’m right in between the two. I’m pretty extroverted for the most part. Then I need to like come back home and recharge my battery.

But oftentimes, being in a social situation is what gets me charged up. But I get a mix of both. So that’s why I’m right in between the two.

I just find that. And this is something a vocal teacher said to me when I was in high school, is that our voices are so there’s a specific word she used, I forget. But our words, our voices are so important to us.

And it’s very vulnerable to share our voice with the world, especially if we’re not, you know, used to this, like a child star who gets raised in this from a young age and grows up into it. Like, it takes time to get used to being in front of people. For some people, they go on stage and it’s just like, whatever, even if they’ve never been on stage before, they’re just chilling.

They’re like, whatever, what’s the big deal? Well, for me, I get nervous. And I have to like do some deep breaths.

I do my the what Sharpay does in high school music with the right before I open my mouth. I’m like, let me just shake it all out and get into character or whatever I got to do. And I got to just focus.

[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Do you do you do once you’re on stage, once you’re performing, do you enjoy it?

[Tika McLean]
Oh, yes. Oh, yeah. There is nothing else that I would do.

I have tried so many other jobs and I just it’s not for me. Like performing is the only thing besides building community is the only thing that actually makes me happy. So.

[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. I mean, when it comes down to it, theatre is the formation of a community, right? And once you get people into a room and performers on a stage, you have formed in some way a community.

You know, one of the things that I used to have trouble with, I did performing easy. That was the like, oh, I loved it. It was great.

And then I would come off stage and have to, like, talk to people. Like audience members, and I’d be like, this is how this is the worst thing I could possibly do. And it took so long to be able to, like, not look like I was angry when I was talking to people who’d just seen the show.

You know what I mean?

[Tika McLean]
Yep. Yep. Yep.

I feel that way. I had to. The biggest thing for me that made that switch for me to just be confident, even if you don’t feel it, just like fake it till you make it, was telling myself over and over again, this is a job.

So just like you would work any other job, you know, other people are coming to watch the show, just like what directors always say when, when we have our final show, it’s like, I know it’s the final show, but you can’t goof off. You know, you want to throw in some, like, fun little Easter eggs and stuff in there for the audience because it’s the final show, but don’t do that. These people pay to see the show just like everybody else did all the other nights.

So constantly hearing that and then learning for myself the ins and outs of the industry, how to maneuver it, contracts, different things like that. Like, one of my favourite books is, I’m looking at right now, All You Need to Know About the Music Industry. I, I forget the author’s name right now, but I, because I can’t read, that’s way too small, but I love that book.

And there’s a Canadian version because there’s an American one and then there’s a Canadian version as well, since there’s slight differences in the industry and just learning all of those things. I’m like, people are paying to see me. I can’t go on stage and be like, Larry, let’s not waste people’s money.

And that just gets me like, okay, we got to be confident. You can’t waste people’s money.

[Phil Rickaby]
No, not at all. You know, what I started to do after a show, once I started, once I, once I convinced myself that after the show meeting people was still part of the show, I was like, oh, okay. Okay.

What, as long as I’m in that building or outside that building, it’s still part of the show. If I’m meeting people who saw the show, if I’m talking to people, I’m still performing. And that made it something I could deal with, you know, instead of, instead of like, I hate talking to people.

[Tika McLean]
I got to get out of here as quick as possible. Now I get that. That makes sense to me.

Yeah.

[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. I want to talk about, I mean, you’ve talked about building community and you’ve talked to, you’ve alluded to the topic that I want to talk about next, which is using art as activism. Talk a little bit about what that means to you.

And let’s get into how you came to that.

[Tika McLean]
Okay. What that means to me. I’ve, there’s been a movement to war in the overall entertainment industry towards kind of distracting the audience from all the bad things that are happening in the world.

Instead of how it used to be like with the introduction of hip hop being used by the black community to talk about oppression and systemic racism and oppression that they were, that we were experiencing and still are experiencing at this point in time, just in slightly different ways. There were, I mean, the entertainment industry has always been a distraction at to some extent over centuries, but I feel that there has been such a movement away from let’s talk about the real issues and also have a great beat. Like, why is that not possible?

Like, and I started to notice it around, especially like 2010 with the coming out of a lot of house music type of thing like that, the focus was let’s just party until we die. Like almost every song was party until we die. And I know that we were going through a bit of a recession during that time.

So that makes sense. After that point, during that point, actually, I started exploring other countries, music, learning about K-pop, all these different things, because I was like, I’m so tired of, we’re all just thinking about party till we die. Can we, can I hear anything else?

Just anything, a different language, a different sound, anything. And so I love to release music and art, skits, comedies, skits, stuff like that, that isn’t, that talks about serious stuff, but does it in a fun, entertaining way. Because I know realistically, that people aren’t going to be interested or engaged in what the content that I’m giving them, if it doesn’t have some sort of entertaining aspect to it.

So like, you can’t just be speaking to someone and be like, well, this is what’s going on with the world. And because they’re just gonna be like, shut down. So I try to have, you know, some entertaining things, something to make you laugh, a good beat.

Like, I know that a lot of people who think that way, artists are called now conscious rappers, stuff like that. It’s its own subgenre, because it’s so, it’s not as big as it used to be. There’s not as many artists who are doing that, because you can so easily release a song about, I don’t know, just so many different things you can release a song about.

And it’s just like, yeah, no, I love that song. And it’s not that I don’t love fun songs like that. I do.

It’s just why is that the only thing that we’re talking about?

[Phil Rickaby]
I mean, we get that in the theatre too, right? In straight plays, especially in Canada, we tend to really deal, you know, if you’re, if you’re looking outside of say, the larger Mirvish theatres, you’re looking at plays that are important. But, but I got into trouble last, a couple of years ago, I mentioned that maybe we should entertain people more.

And a few people got really angry about that. But we should do both, right? Like, like, the things that we present should, should be entertaining.

And people should want to see them. Yeah. While we are talking about issues, right?

While we were talking about important things, we can and should do both.

[Tika McLean]
Yeah.

[Phil Rickaby]
Right? Yeah. It’s, it’s wild.

You were talking about discovering music from other places. Did, was there, what was it about, say, for example, Korean music that you were, that you were looking at, or music from other places that sort of fed your, your desire to hear something different and something more important?

[Tika McLean]
Well, for one thing, and this kind of ties into what we were talking about previously and this question, I started noticing patterns when I was studying other artists that I had admired growing up. I just started to notice, oh, well, when this person does this, the fan’s reaction is like this. But when this other person does the same thing, the fan reaction is different.

I noticed that some people were getting canceled for things that other people weren’t getting canceled for. And it could have been due to discrimination, or it could have been due mostly from what I’ve seen just to proper, I guess, proper quote unquote, branding. The way that you brand yourself, you brand yourself as someone who doesn’t give a bop about the politics and all those different types of things, then you’re going to create a fan base and an audience that doesn’t care either.

And I noticed that when a performer may have like an injury or something like that, and they can’t perform, the reaction that the audience has a lot of the time, depending on the brand that they’ve built, and the messages that they put into their art can cause the audience to react to them in different ways. Like, oh, I don’t care if they broke their ankle or something like that. I need Justin Bieber to perform on stage for me right now.

Like people, every artist has a different type of audience base because of their branding. And once I noticed that, I was like, well, I want to make sure that I also talk about these important things because I don’t want to garner an audience of people who are brain dead. I want people to use their brains, turn it off sometimes, of course, let’s just have a good time.

And then at other times, turn it on. I don’t want your brain to be completely off all the time, because then you’re not going to have any compassion for it.

[Phil Rickaby]
That’s a very interesting thing, because when, you know, there are times when people need the brain off. Yes, they need the popcorn movie, they need the popcorn, they need the easy on the brain TV show. But that should be the the exception rather than the rule, right?

We should be able to demand or require that people have their brains on while they are watching a thing or consuming a thing. I do think that, that, you know, now a lot of the TV shows, a lot of the streaming shows there, they’re building them for second screen.

[Tika McLean]
Yes.

[Phil Rickaby]
Right. So that, you know, people don’t have to pay attention because they’re on their phones. But that has led to people like misunderstanding whole shows.

Because they just weren’t paying attention. I think it’s one of the things that I love about theatre is that your phone goes away, your phone goes off. And we are in the room together watching a thing.

And I think that that’s one of the it’s one of the only spaces left where that happens.

[Tika McLean]
Exactly. Like, I fully understand I have struggled with mental health and chronic pain, disabilities, different stuff like that. And that’s still stuff I’m going through to this day.

So I completely understand, especially with all the chaos happening in the world right now, that we just need to just like sometimes just buy. So of course, I make sure to laugh every day, I make sure to find something funny to watch. I’m making sure that there’s comedy in my rotation, but I’m also making sure not to ignore what’s going on.

I’m helping my community, helping with the homeless people who experience homelessness. I mean, like, we can’t just completely ignore it or else the problems will continue. You can’t expect some hero to come along and fix everything that’s not going to happen.

[Phil Rickaby]
That only happens in the comic books and in the movie. And in the real world, that doesn’t happen. We all have to be those heroes.

And we have to take action. You mentioned chronic pain, and you are somebody who has navigated performing on stage and in music as somebody who has a disability. So what’s the experience of that like for you?

How do you navigate? Sometimes people can be really insensitive in those situations. People, although we think, oh, people must be more aware, and it’s surprising how often people are not.

How do you navigate those spaces?

[Tika McLean]
With a lot of breathing, large amounts of deep breathing, because I’ve come to, I’ve had disabilities my whole life since I was a little kid, but it was only, I’d say, this year that I fully came to terms with the fact that growing up, I was highly gaslit by family and healthcare professionals, that the pain that I was experiencing wasn’t real. Because of my young age, while you’re young, you cannot be experiencing that level of pain. I’ve heard that too many times throughout my life.

Or the simple go-to for a lot of healthcare professionals is, well, you just have to lose the weight. I can tell you, I have been every size under the sun. It has not affected, it has not changed my pain levels for the better or for the worse.

It’s been just as bad when I was the skinniest and I was the biggest. It doesn’t matter. My vitals are amazing, so every time someone says to me, just lose weight, I’m like, literally, that’s not the issue.

But you get a lot of people who are ignorant in this way, because a lot of people just don’t take the time to learn about issues that affect people other than themselves. Unfortunately, a lot of the time, especially on Turtle Island, a lot of us have been taught to be independent and to also not be weak. And if you show emotions, if you set up boundaries, if you call someone out for something in a loving, compassionate way, it can be seen as a weakness, or you’re so sensitive, stuff like that.

So now, I’m just like, fine, call me sensitive. I love being sensitive. I’m in touch with my emotions, whatever.

I don’t care. I have to protect me. Nobody else is going to protect me, but me.

And nobody else is going to advocate for me in the healthcare setting, in any environment, except for me. And especially being an adult, there’s a lot more responsibility that healthcare professionals put on you, even if you’re not a doctor. I didn’t go to medical school.

I do have a background as a PSW, but that’s a different education level than a doctor. So of course, I don’t know everything. And I’ve noticed that a lot of healthcare professionals can be very impatient and forget that not everybody is a doctor.

Like you need to speak to your patients in a way with layman terms, help us understand what’s going on. Give us the time to ask questions. Don’t rush us in and out of the office.

Let us talk. But I try to navigate those environments with just a lot of understanding and patience, but it can be really frustrating because of that patience and understanding and compassion isn’t always being given back to me.

[Phil Rickaby]
No. And of course, we all have a limited font of patience at times, right? You can only say the same thing so many times before you lose your patience.

I think the world needs more sensitivity. I think that we’ve been in a world where the phrase, you’re too sensitive has been used as a cudgel, as a way of insulting people. But I think that we could use more of that stuff.

We could use more sensitivity. And I find that as I get older, my sensitivity is through the roof. I’ve cried only three times today, right?

And that’s not a bad day. I think that things affect me, right? And I think it’s important to let things affect you because that’s how you know you’re still alive, how you’re still human, and how that leads to making change.

If things affect you, you start to drive for change, right?

[Tika McLean]
Yeah. Yeah. That’s exactly why, with the crying three times a day, I fully understand that.

My goodness, do I ever. My goodness. But yeah, there’s a new product that I’m trying to do, or not trying to do, that I’m working on.

It makes it sound like I can’t make it happen. It’s in the midst of happening. And it’s called Koreaboo, Black Girl Hero.

And it’s going to be an EP. So far, I have two songs made for the EP. And right now, I believe I have a track list of five.

So I’m a little pathway through. And it combines my love for K-pop, which is a whole other world in and of itself. My goodness, I could talk for hours about it because it is a whole other world.

Like the training, idol system, all these different things. And wow, it’s another world, a whole different culture. And also, things that I’ve noticed while paying attention and learning about South Korean culture, the entertainment industry, there’s unfortunately a lot of racism over there towards Black folks.

So that’s something that I just had a hard time ignoring. And for a lot, a lot of K-pop fans are actually left. We just gravitate towards it because it’s like, there’s this, somebody described it so perfectly once.

It’s like when we find something that can reach us, like the music, the beat. A lot of Korean, South Korean entertainment agencies have said that they are highly influenced from Black artists. Like, that’s not a secret.

They talk about it all the time. So even if you look back at like 90s K-pop music, it was heavily influenced by R&B boy groups and girl groups from Turtle Island, Black specifically. At TLC and Boyz II Men and different things like that.

They love Chris Brown over there to the moon and back. Oh my goodness. And Will Smith.

Those are the only two Black men they ever talk about. I’m not even saying that in a rude way. If you watch a whole bunch of South Korean content, and I have watched a lot, that is the two Black people they will talk about the most.

And Beyonce and Michael Jackson. Those are the four people that they talk about the most. And it’s like, they’ll do a lot of Blackface over there.

A lot of the comedians to this day, they still do it. Some of the celebrities as well still do Blackface. And so when I’m watching this, I’m like, you know that you have a whole bunch of Black fans that support you.

Why do you keep being racist towards us? And that’s a whole other conversation. But there’s for sure internalized racism there.

And I just started to see, I love noticing the connections between different things. Helps me to learn about the world. That’s just how my brain works.

So I was noticing how so many Black folks are moving towards K-pop. I’m seeing the interconnections between K-pop, South Korean culture and Black culture. And I’m like, I want to make an album about this.

And capitalism as well. Because they are all intertwined. They are like, the way that we constantly will move towards the people or the things that hurt us.

And the way that specifically the Black community will give our money to people who are outside of the Black community, who may be hurting us. Like specifically the types of people that are hurting us. And we just, we don’t do anything to fix them.

We can’t come together as a community. Like there’s so many, I always get this word wrong, diaspora, diaspora wars happening amongst all the different types of Black people. We’re having Africans against Caribbean.

We’re having Africans against Black Americans. And it’s like, why are we doing this to ourselves? Like we should stop allowing outside forces to separate us.

We should come together, especially during this time. And we love music. So I said, well, let’s talk about this.

So hopefully me saying all that makes sense, how it interconnects in a way. Like I don’t have time to go into detail, but you know, you’ll see more.

[Phil Rickaby]
In terms of like creating like your own K-pop EP. Yeah. What’s that?

Are you working with musicians? Are you writing it yourself? Like how are you putting that EP together?

[Tika McLean]
So I have all the lyrics written out already. I did that, I think last year I wrote all the lyrics. I just, I don’t know what’s the best thing to do, to do lyrics first or write a beat first.

So I tried both. And for me, I think just writing the lyrics and then maneuvering it into the beat, changing things around is what works best for me. I know every artist has their own process, but I just wrote out the lyrics for all the songs.

I’m telling a story. I’m incorporating my musical theatre background because I want everything to flow like a story. So everything connects and it has the start and has the end.

And you get to see the story of the villain, Koreaboo, because a Koreaboo is a is a person who isn’t South Korean, who is obsessed with South Korean culture and basically wants to be South Korean. And in a cringy, obsessive way, the term for that would be Koreaboo. I’m just like, you know what?

People used to bully me in high school for liking K-pop simply because, well, how do you understand what they’re saying? And I’m like, that’s racism, first of all. But anyways, first of all.

But I’m just taking all of that. I have my social media handles as angry black women because I’m like, I’m just going to take all of the stereotypes and run with it. Let’s just go.

We get to see Koreaboo, the villain, who’s who’s not really a villain, but it’s just the black girl that really likes an alternative type of music that often gets villainized by other people, especially black people, for not fitting a specific norm, the stereotype that’s acceptable for black people. So she’s not really a villain, but other people are villainizing her. And she’s going to learn on this journey more about her own blackness, her own morals and values, and not allowing other people to tear her down.

It’s basically the concept of the album.

[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. I mean, you’re talking about how, you know, why would you listen to that? You don’t understand.

You don’t even know what they’re singing about. How many people are listening to songs right now that they’re either mishearing the lyrics on or they’re just not even paying attention?

[Tika McLean]
Right.

[Phil Rickaby]
It doesn’t you don’t have to know what the lyrics are to enjoy the music. And I can name a bunch of bands that sing in different languages. Right.

But they’re they’re putting out hits. Yeah. So like language is language.

Music is the language, not the not the words of the song. Exactly. Right.

[Tika McLean]
Exactly.

[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Tell me about your short film, Happy.

[Tika McLean]
Well, it also has to do with racism because I’m like, you know, well, let’s just talk about it. It’s important issue. Let’s talk about it.

So Happy, I spelled it H-A-P-P-E-E. I came up with this idea in university and I think 2018, I was going to York University at the time for theatre. I love that school.

I recommend that school to anybody. That school is just, oh, my gosh, I love it to death. But they do go on strike like every other year, like without a doubt on schedule.

Every other year they go on strike. It’s without fail every other year. But any who, besides that, it’s a great school, the community there.

Any who. So I came up with an idea because we had a short a short play festival that we all were able to submit to as students. So we all had to write our own script.

It had to be like five minutes or less. And I was originally going to talk about my upbringing and just abuse that I went through and different things like that. I read the script out to a friend and the friend was like, that’s a little too dark.

I said, too? And she’s like, yes. I was like, OK, fine.

I came up with a different idea and I was happy. And it’s meant to be following a scientist who creates a a drug that is anti-racism and an anti-depressant. So anybody who takes this pill will no longer be racist and will no longer be.

And that in and of itself sounds ridiculous. And that was the point. As I go back and reread the script after I already put it out into the world on social media and I’d love to put it on stage one day.

The happy drug is meant to be symbolizing social media, all of the distractions that we use to this day. It even could be a toxic partner, like whatever, that we use to distract ourselves from the root issues that we refuse to deal with because that takes effort, energy, courage and time. And we’re often too busy for that.

So I find that when people go on social media, for instance, and I don’t think social media is all bad. There’s pros and cons, especially for people with disabilities. That’s how a lot of us socialize.

If we can’t go outside as often as people without the disabilities we have. And it also can connect people. Now, social media has pros and it has cons.

People will go on social media. They could scroll for hours and hours and hours and everything just feels so much better. Or you can go to a concert and everything just feels so much better.

But it feels like everybody just like comes together when it comes to art. It just really brings people together. And for a moment, all of our problems just kind of go away.

We forget about racism. We forget about paying our bills, going to work tomorrow, whatever. We forget about it all.

And we just kind of come together in that moment. In that way, I was like, OK, happy. An antidepressant, an anti-racism drug.

But I didn’t want to just outright say, well, this is social media or this is this and that. Like I wanted it to be funny as well and make you think. So, yeah, the scientist goes to the government of Canada and the government of Canada is so or Health Canada, I guess, because they’re the ones that say yay or nay to new drugs.

And health government of Canada is like, oh, we really want to beat Finland and become the number one happiest country in the world. So we are going to allow this drug to be.

[Phil Rickaby]
So the Health Canada. And so I have to I have to stop it like the happiness competition with Finland is not something I not something I thought where it was a place we were going to go. But it makes perfect sense.

It makes perfect sense.

[Tika McLean]
Right. Like like I said earlier, like I wanted to talk about these things, but I also want to make sure it’s fun. Like, come on.

So, yeah, Canada wants to be Finland and become the number one happiest country in the world to be like, yes, let’s put this drug on the market. The drug goes on the market. And then we start to see how it affects people.

There’s a racist grandpa. We get to see how he gets affected by it. There is a whole bunch of different characters, a YouTuber.

We get to see how the YouTuber is affected by it, like just all sorts of different aspects. And it’s just a short little film. I split it into different parts.

One day I’ll try to make it into one so people can just watch it at once. But yeah, I think about why we’re still part of my social media. It’s on all my pages, YouTube, YouTube, TikTok, Instagram.

And I just I don’t want to spoil the ending, but, you know, I think that’s it.

[Phil Rickaby]
You know, it’s funny because you’re talking about social media and, you know, you’re absolutely right that social media has its good and its bad. The bad has been, you know, growing over the years. I remember I know people who joined Twitter too late.

It’s Twitter. It will always be Twitter. Right.

Anyway, when I joined it, like within the first two years after it came out, man, it was a wonderful place. It was it was connection and it was silly and it was it was weird and it was magical and and black Twitter was great. And all of the Twitters were great.

And people were having like like great discourse about silly things like TV shows and and all kinds of stuff. And then it, you know, it would kept joining. And the more people would join, the more terrible people would join.

And it just like devolved and sort of like all of our social media has in many ways sort of followed that in a lot of ways. But, you know, the having that that algorithm, when the algorithm hits on a bad day and you just want to throw your phone across the room and then the other days when it just gives you nothing but like cats and dogs and fun people, you’re like, that’s why I stay on it. And it’s it’s it’s a it is it we used to say that the television was the opiate of the masses.

Right. Yeah. No, TikTok reels, Instagram.

That’s the opiate of the masses now.

[Tika McLean]
Oh, yes. I mean, I truly believe that entertainment can really mold society like a lot of us when it comes to relationships. Nowadays, things are much different.

I mean, there’s still some people who we call pick me, but, you know, it’s a good time, whatever, live your best life. But for sure, the way we go about romantic relationships, the way we interact with our loved ones, the the jobs we desire, this what success looks like to a lot of people, hustle culture, all of these things were things that were in part learned from the movies that we watched growing up, like little girl thinking that, oh, our sole focus should be on finding our prince charming, our white knight and and riding off into the sunset with him and then just having 10,000 babies, you know. It’s like there’s growing up, I used to think to myself, there has to be other things that we can discuss whenever I would have conversations with other with other girls, but not all. It’s like we would always have to talk about boys.

Why can’t we talk about anything else like anything? And so I started doing research on love and when people would say love at first sight and different things like that, because I just wanted to understand humans better, because I’m like, why do we think this way? Why do we act this way?

And I started noticing just having conversations with various people that a lot of people get their education from what they watch on TV, the games that they play, the music that they listen to, and not everybody, and it may affect us in different ways, but it for sure has a hold on us. I mean, the fact that we’re willing to spend hundreds of dollars just to see somebody in a concert for a couple of hours is fascinating. Like concerts aren’t cheap and I’m not saying don’t go to concerts, I’m just saying concerts aren’t cheap and people will say I’m so broke, I can’t afford to pay this bill, but I do need to go to a music.

[Phil Rickaby]
I want to touch on the price of concerts for a second. This is off topic, but I grew up at a time because I’m old, but concert tickets, do you know how much we paid for a concert ticket when I was a teenager in 1980, whatever, to see the biggest bands? Oh, it was much cheaper.

Between 15 and 20 dollars to see a band and that’s expensive. So the fact that, and of course we can lay that at the feet of capitalism, not just capitalism, but also specifically Ticketmaster and all of that kind of monopoly stuff, but the problem I think is that the capitalism puts the art out of reach and turns it into something for the elite rather than something for the people and that’s a problem for everybody.

[Tika McLean]
I don’t think this is off topic at all. This is exactly what I’m going to be talking about with Koreaboo, like this is exactly it because, how should I say this, the where we put our money it will grow. Whatever we’re investing in it will grow and a lot of people are investing in things and then going on social media and saying I hate that this corporation exists, I hate that this monopoly exists.

Well yeah, because we kept putting our money in there. What did you think was going to happen? It’s like whenever people talk about the Kardashians, it’s like oh my gosh I hate seeing the Kardashians on my screen.

Okay, well stop watching them. Stop paying attention to them then. If you don’t like somebody and you don’t want them to succeed, maybe don’t invest your money.

This is something that people are starting to finally understand, especially, I wouldn’t say my generation and younger, but a lot of generations are finally starting to understand where we place our money has an effect on the way we live our lives, has an effect on society, has an effect on the economy, like our mental health.

[Phil Rickaby]
It’s what we give our attention to as well, right? Like what we focus on. You’re mentioning how movies and television and music affect how people date, how they move through their lives and all that sort of thing.

It’s important. I think you’re right that it does affect people in different ways, right? If you are not somebody who thinks critically about things, it’s going to affect you more because you’re not going to examine what’s being put into your brain.

You’re not going to, why is this here? Who made this? Why are they saying this?

If you’re not going to think critically about it, it’s going to hit you in a different way than if you’re really thinking deeply about it.

[Tika McLean]
Yeah, like specifically with Koreaboo, K-pop is now becoming such a major thing now. Many households now know the name K-pop. A lot of people know BTS, Blackpink, such like that.

That was not too much of a thing even just a few years ago. So the thing is that it became popular because people started investing their money into that. It became so popular.

I mean, you see the glitz, the glam, the colors, the music videos, the singing, the dancing, how could you not get into it? It’s amazing. It’s amazing.

And then you have people, Asian folks now too are getting in on it and talking about how Black people have been talking about how K-pop has constantly been using Black resources, been copying Black artists and not giving them credit and such. And people are upset that K-pop, some people are upset that K-pop is such a big thing. And there’s so many people that don’t know about the racism that is involved in it.

I’m heavily, heavily influenced by Black culture and Black artists. So I just wanted to talk about that because it’s like, for me, I sit back and I go, how do people not notice that where you put your money and your attention matters? It will help that person or thing to grow.

And you know, I didn’t know that growing up too, some people are ahead of the game, smarter than others, or just aware of things faster than other people are. Because growing up, I remember my dad tried to give me Barack Obama’s biography book and I did not want to read it. I was like, no, I don’t want to read it.

I was very happy he was not our president. What am I saying? Like, I’m in America.

The first Black president is our president, the whole world’s president, I guess. But like, just because of the fact that it was the first Black president, but I just was not interested in reading that book. And I mean, also getting a book from him, we don’t have a good relationship.

So I was like, I don’t want to read anything from you. But also it’s just that I learned that I have ADHD. So being neurodivergent, I only learned that like 2021 or something like that.

So I was already done with school. I’m an adult. Like I could have learned this information when I was in school, so that I could have had a better education and learn things because there’s so many things that I was unable to get that my parents were trying to teach me or that they were trying to teach me in school or healthcare, whatever.

That just wasn’t getting into my brain because it wasn’t being taught to me in a way that made sense, that was accessible for people with ADHD. So like that’s also something I tried to talk about, that we need to be inclusive or else people aren’t going to learn.

[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. When you were diagnosed with ADHD, once you figured that out, did that fill in a lot of blanks for you?

[Tika McLean]
Yes. I have a feeling the strongest thing I know when I have something before I go to the doctor. When I was a kid, I knew I had depression and I didn’t even know what depression was.

Mental health wasn’t even talked about yet until I was an adult. Then I started noticing, oh, we’re talking about mental health a lot more. But like when I was in school, are you kidding me?

Like the thing that people were getting bullied over, our thing that it’s not a thing now. Like you’d get canceled for that and it’s a different world. But yeah, if I had known that growing up, like I was horrible with math.

I had to go on an IEP in elementary school because I was so bad at math, yet my reading ability was at an adult level above every other kid in my class, yet I could not answer a simple math equation. What should I mean? Reading has always been my thing.

And maybe it’s because of my reading levels compared to my math levels that maybe the teachers were like, he doesn’t need to be further assessed for ADHD. I don’t know. But my math levels like were really, really bad.

But and I didn’t study. I did not study until I got to university. I never studied.

I didn’t know how. And just having to retain information and hold on to it when you have to do a test. Now, my brain doesn’t hold it.

[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Yeah. It’s funny because you’re talking about being bad at math and really, like really being like reading.

Yeah. When I was in grade six, I was reading at like a grade 12 level. Right.

I was like reading so well. But I like you, I couldn’t do math. Yep.

Right. I could not. And it was later that I was diagnosed with I guess I was in my early teens when they diagnosed me with a math perception problem.

But that didn’t have a name yet. So I thought I was the only one. Right.

I’m the only person who has this. I’m dumb because I can’t do this simple thing. I made somebody who was the teacher made them try to help me with math.

My perception of math was so bad, they snapped three pencils just out of frustration. But then I learned as an adult that that has a name. It’s called dyscalculia.

I knew it. Yeah. And so it has a name and giving the thing the name was so powerful.

This has a name. It’s not just me. There’s other people who have this.

It’s so powerful to be able to name the thing. And it makes things make so much sense for you.

[Tika McLean]
Yes, I fully agree with that. Getting a diagnosis can honestly change your life because then you’re able to learn accommodations that you can ask for at work, at school, at home, you can you can actually start living life like everybody else’s because now you finally know what to do. You know that you’re not crazy.

You’re not abnormal. You just are different.

[Phil Rickaby]
Absolutely. In the time that we have left, I want to delve a little bit more into your road to becoming a performer. Okay.

Becoming the person that you are now. You mentioned even though you went to York University, you mentioned being a wanted to be a performer from the time that you were quite young. But how did you discover theatre?

What was the thing that that introduced you to theatre and made you want to do it?

[Tika McLean]
I have no idea. I don’t remember now. I don’t know.

I’ve always said that since I was a little kid, like a toddler, that I just was always up and dancing. There’s a video that my dad has of me as a little baby just standing right in front of the TV. This is like maybe this had to be like, I don’t know.

Anyways, the TV wasn’t it was like 1999 or something like that. So I’m standing in front of the TV in my diaper and Barbie girl is on. I know my girl.

And so I’m there and I’m just watching to maybe maybe it was from then. Maybe there was something in Barbie that Barbie song that set me off. I don’t know.

But that that’s my origin story, because I just always knew that this is what I wanted to do. I’ve thought of being a pride attendant. I’ve thought of doing all these other things like I’ve thought of it because other people like, well, you don’t really make too much money of an artist.

I’m like, okay, fine. Let me try everything else. But no, this is what I have to do.

I don’t know what it was. I just say it’s Barbie.

[Phil Rickaby]
It’s funny how people are like discouraging you from make from, you know, oh, don’t don’t become an artist. Don’t make theatre. Don’t do this.

Don’t be a performer. You’re not going to make enough money at it. But it’s such a thing that we as humans need.

We need art. We need entertainment. We need theatre.

We need dance. We need all of it. And so somebody has to make it.

And we’re constantly telling people like, oh, you shouldn’t you shouldn’t pursue that. You won’t make a living at it. Right.

[Tika McLean]
Like music is such an integral part of our life, not even just music. Art theatre is all I know. I realize I talk more about music than theatre.

[Phil Rickaby]
That’s all right. That’s all right. We’re talking about you and your your world and your your artistic practice today.

[Tika McLean]
I mean, though, but like theatre and music is life for me. And like you said, it is a need. I have tried to live my life in a way that was more pleasing for others and excluding my desire to pursue music out of this fear that I’m not going to be able to be financially secure.

But at this point, music is the only thing that’s really and not just music. Performing is what keeps me alive. Like there’s so much craziness going on.

There’s like I said, I have lots of health concerns I struggle with. So being able to have performing art in my life, being able to express myself through painting, through dancing, through singing, through acting. He’s all I can ask for.

It’s all I want. There’s nothing else that I want. Money would be nice.

[Phil Rickaby]
I mean, money would always be nice. You got to you got to live. Right.

But I mean, it’s there’s so many people who listen. This is the thing I don’t know about you. If you notice this when you after you graduated, there’s I can look at the people that I graduated theatre school with and very few are still doing this.

Well, you know, because it’s it’s it’s hard, right? It’s hard and it burns people out. And and and people suddenly start thinking, like, I would like to have things.

And it the you know, if you can’t find a balance, you can’t get a day job and do this, then you have to choose one. And I think a lot of people end up choosing the day job. Exactly.

But it is possible. It is. And people have to make it.

People have to do this. Otherwise, we won’t have anything entertaining.

[Tika McLean]
A world without music isn’t isn’t the world I want to be part of. So.

[Phil Rickaby]
Agreed. Agreed. Well, Tika, thank you so much for joining me.

I’ve really appreciated this conversation. I’ve enjoyed myself. Thank you so much for being on the podcast today.

[Tika McLean]
Thank you so much. This was a great conversation. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you.

[Phil Rickaby]
Thank you for listening to this week’s episode of Stageworthy. I’m going to tell you about who my guest is next week, who my guests are next week. But first, let’s do a little bit of housekeeping.

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And if you’re there, make sure that you like the episode and comments that I know that you were watching. And if you’ve been enjoying the show, hit the subscribe button and hit that bell icon so that whenever a new episode comes out, you will get notified that a new episode is available. Now, let’s talk about next week.

Next week, my guests are the leaders of the Goblin Empire themselves, Rebecca Northan and Bruce Horak. They joined me to talk about Goblin:Macbeth, which is currently on at Montreal’s Centaur Theatre. So if you’re in Montreal or heading to Montreal, do not miss that.

We talk a little bit about Bruce’s time on Star Trek. We talk about Rebecca and Bruce’s meeting and just getting to know them both and this show and how Goblin:Macbeth came about. So make sure that you tune in next week for my conversation with Rebecca Northern and Bruce Horak.