Kelly Taylor and Hools Kay are Un (Capital F) Famous in Toronto
About This Episode:
Kelly Taylor is the kind of artist who doesn’t wait for permission. When the roles aren’t coming, she writes them. When she doesn’t get into fringe, she books her own theatre. When she needs a director, she calls a friend she trusts, Hools Kay. That spirit is exactly what Un (Capital F) Famous is built on: a show about an actress who loses everything and has to find her way back to the art that made her fall in love with performing in the first place. In this conversation, Kelly and Hools talk about how the show came together, what it was like growing up in a clown family, Fringe touring and much more!
Guests: 🎠Kelly Taylor and Hools Kay
Kelly Taylor is a jill-of-all-trades who has extensive experience wearing many different creative hats. Hailing from a family of literal- clowns, comedy runs through the this purple haired millennial veins. Kelly is a voice actor specializing in animation, a writer, a producer and an actor. Kelly creates comedy inspired by her zany life and engages her audiences through her personal flare and eternal optimism.
A neurodivergent, queer, creative, Hools Kay has been around the block for all things art making. After spending the last 7 years working on creating their own series and having that bubble burst abruptly this past summer, Hools is super stoked to be in the director’s chair for their Toronto directorial debut. As an actor, Hools can be found doing interactive performances with companies across the city like The Dinner Detective and EscapeShow. They have always found brilliance in collective creation with passionate artists, and working alongside Kelly Taylor fits that description perfectly.
Connect with Kelly & Hools
Kelly’s Instagram: @itskellytaylor
Hools’ Instagram: @hookslaybae
Get tickets to Un (Capital F) Famous: https://www.eventbrite.com/o/kelly-taylor-121616969983
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Transcript
[Phil Rickaby]
Hello, welcome to Stageworthy. I’m Phil Rickaby, the host and producer of this podcast. Stageworthy is Canada’s theatre podcast, and on Stageworthy, I talk to theatre makers of all kinds, from actors to directors to playwrights and more.
If they make theatre in Canada, I talk to them. Some of the people I talk to are household names, and the rest are people that I really think you should get to know. I’ll get to this week’s guest in just one second, but first, I do want to mention my Patreon.
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Anyway, that’s enough housekeeping. Let’s get into the show. My guests this week are Kelly Taylor and Hools Kay.
They are the one of the creators and one of the and the director of Un (Captial F) Famous, which is coming up this week. As you listen to this, that show is running at the Red Sandcastle Theatre in Toronto from October 8th to 11th. So make sure you check that out.
I love this conversation. It’s such a joy to talk to both to both Kelly and Hools. So here’s my conversation with Kelly Taylor and Hools Kay.
Kelly Taylor, Hools Kay. Thank you so much for joining me. It’s a pleasure to see you both.
Hools, you’re an old friend of the podcast. And Kelly, it is great to meet you. Let us talk about Un (Captial F) Famous.
So Kelly, why don’t you give me what is the what? Tell me what this show is. What is this show?
[Kelly Taylor]
It’s your brainchild. It’s my brainchild. So it was inspired by the best creative year of my life, followed by the worst creative year of my life.
And I wanted to make a show that kind of documented that. Like, I think as an actor, we put so much thought and emphasis on like, are we a working actor? How many auditions do we have lined up?
How many gigs do we booked? You know, someone asks you, what do you what do you do? Do you tell them your job?
Do you tell them that you’re an actor? You know? And if you’re not getting paid, are you still an actor?
Only things that go through your mind. As I kind of wanted to write about that, but not make it autobiographical. So I was like, what can I do to make this so far away from my real life, but still be inspired by my real life.
So I came up with the concept of a story about an actress who gets fired from her show, thought by being dropped by her agent, losing her work visa, because you know, she’s Canadian, so you know, she’s got to fly back home, having her boyfriend publicly cheat on her at the Met Gala, and having to accept a joe job, which I feel like sometimes is every actor’s worst fear. But in the heart of the story, she rediscovers who she is and where she came from. She used to do theatre back in the day before she got caught up in this like, Hollywood lifestyle.
And she meets this really great friend at the cafe that she works for. And they kind of help each other. They’re like these polar opposites of like, you know, like an Al Woods with like a Wednesday Addams, kind of, you know, Wednesday and Al in like the same universe.
That’s kind of what it is. Yeah. And they just sort of, they kind of help each other find each other.
It’s like help each other find each other again, in a way. So she kind of discovers, you know, I used to love performing live. I used to love theatre.
It was so raw and organic and fulfilling. And it’s just a beautiful story. Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Now, these things that you described, all of these things that have happened to the character whose name is Lavender, I believe. Yes. These are things you invented?
[Kelly Taylor]
No resemblance.
[Phil Rickaby]
These were inventions?
[Kelly Taylor]
The things that have happened to her?
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
Theoretically, yes. I did get fired. I did get fired from a gig.
Yeah. And I won’t name names. I don’t want to get sued.
But I was a part of a show. That was a part of like the best year. So I was a part of the show.
It was great. I was a working actor. And I’m like, oh my god, this next year is going to be so good.
And it’s just like crickets. And then the show that I was a part of was doing a remount. And I’m like, oh, and it’s like, oh my god, did you hit the remounting this?
My friend’s like, yeah, I got the email. I’m like, you got the email? And then there’s like this group chat.
The group chat starts blowing up and being like, hey, how does everyone feel about the revival? I was like, that wasn’t part of the revival. So I was like the only person not asked that, which in acting world, sometimes not getting a contract from renewed is the equivalent of being fired.
So yeah, I did kind of go through something similar where my show dropped me. And I don’t have an agent, but myself as my own agent, I was trying to, you know, book everything I could. And I keep getting these auditions and I’m booking absolutely nothing.
And I’m like, what are the odds that I spend a whole year not booking a single fucking job?
[Hools Kay]
Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
So when I think like kind of like meta, I started writing again and I picked up this story and as a joke was like, maybe I’ll write a story about an actor who gets fired from her job and has to get like a normal job.
[Phil Rickaby]
Now, Hools, you’re directing this show. What drew you to this show?
[Hools Kay]
This person right here.
[Kelly Taylor]
I will say when Kelly originally approached me, I was a dramaturg as well, about directing it.
[Hools Kay]
I didn’t actually know if she was serious and then she’s like, we’re starting rehearsals this month. And I went, oh, oh, you actually want me to direct? No, OK.
Because I haven’t directed anything in Toronto before. I haven’t directed anything that wasn’t a musical or that I didn’t produce. So it’s been a very long time since I’ve actually directed a show.
And so it was just having to rejigger my brain to be like, OK, now I’m the one who makes decisions.
[Kelly Taylor]
So even getting into rehearsal, I was like, I don’t know, Kelly, what do you what do you think about like maybe adding this thing? And she’s like, you’re the director. If you want that, we do.
It’s like, oh.
[Phil Rickaby]
Were you, Hools, were you having trouble making the switch from dramaturge brain to director brain?
[Hools Kay]
I think I went in a little bit with that, but only just because I needed to kind of get used to a rehearsal process.
[Kelly Taylor]
But then going in, I was like, OK, the script’s already written. It’s already been processed. Then there were certain because Kelly wrote it and had a co-writer too.
There was times where it was like, hey, what do you think about this line here? It doesn’t necessarily make sense. As we’re doing it or like bringing something up that didn’t get whatever sussed out when we did the edit, we actually kind of was helpful because as we’re working through it, we’re like, oh, we’re realizing this isn’t making sense on top of that already.
But it didn’t feel like a complete switch or anything. It wasn’t like, oh, I have to make sure every single word is perfect.
[Hools Kay]
It was more of like the flow of something which which was fun to be part of, I think.
[Kelly Taylor]
Changing everything now.
[Phil Rickaby]
Kelly, you are acting in this with Madeleine Rose. Yes. Who I believe directed Thank You, Ex.
Yes. For you. She did.
Yes. And travelled a little bit with you.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah. My best friend. So my first play that I wrote was Thank You, Ex.
With the same co-writer, Nellie McBrath. And yeah, Maddie, same thing with Maddie. I’ve known Maddie for years.
And I was like, when I was writing Thank You, Ex, I was like, I need a director. And she was like, I’ll direct. I’m like, I thought you didn’t want to direct.
She was like, the pandemic changed me. All right. And so she wore that director’s hat.
And I was a big believer in, like, creating your own opportunities and not waiting for, you know, it to be given for you. And I had had this vision, like I wanted to write a solo show so I could travel because I’ve been in like ensemble shows before and like sketch troops. Hools and I were in a sketch troupe, gosh, like nine, nine, nine, ten years ago.
We did Orlando Fringe 2016. Jesus Christ. 2016.
And, you know, like when you’re with an ensemble, you’re dealing with other people’s schedules, other people’s various creative projects. So it’s hard to be on the same page. And I really want to do a fringe tour.
So then I wrote Thank You, Ex. And I was like, I’m I really want to do fringe. I didn’t get into any fringes.
So then I had always loved the East Coast. So then I just rented out a theatre and was like, I’m just going to do my own show, self-produce it in a city I’ve never been to. And then Maddie was like, I’ll go with you.
I’m like. She’s like, I’ll drive. Sounds great.
Have we ever driven across? And I drive. First of all, I don’t have a license.
So when she said to her, yeah, she’s like, I’ll drive. I’m like, it is all you. So, yeah, we drove, pre-strove to Halifax.
And it was it was an experience. And but the same thing with Hools was I worked with Hools for years and they, you know, helped me with like acting, coaching and auditions. So many auditions I didn’t book.
I’ve always loved their approach to, you know, directing me as an actor. And so I was like, OK, well, whenever I do some sort of next project, whatever it might be, I’m like, I knew I wanted Hools. And so when I wrote this, I, you know, was like, Hools, we’re doing this.
And then I also said to Maddie, I wrote a show. Remember, it was a solo show. Well, now it’s a two person play.
I wrote another character. Can you do it? And she’s like, OK, well, I got my show in, you know, in the fall, maybe after my OK, cool.
So October. And she’s like, maybe if we do it end of October, November. So the theater’s booked.
Yeah. And she still says yes. So I love that girl.
She says yes to to anything I ask her. And so, yeah, she’s currently at the time of recording this anyways. She’s in Halifax as we speak with with her show.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yes.
[Kelly Taylor]
And she’s been on your podcast before. So, yeah, she’s going to be she’s going to be diving right in next week when she joins us for rehearsal. We’ll see how much she loves me after that.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah, I think I think she might owe you a bit, but or you might owe her a bit. So you rented a theatre in Halifax to do Thank You X. Yes.
A place that you did not had not been and did not visit before.
[Kelly Taylor]
Didn’t I? I’ve been there before. I used to tour with kids, like kids theatre.
[Phil Rickaby]
OK, so you’d been there before.
[Kelly Taylor]
I had been there before, but I don’t I didn’t know people. I had no connections. I just really like the city.
And I thought, OK, well, when you’re creating art, there’s no guarantee of anything. You can’t guarantee good reviews. You can’t guarantee people are going to like it.
Everyone’s different. You can’t guarantee a good turnout or sold out show. All you can guarantee is the experience you have with it.
So for me, it was important to make a show that I was proud of and be if I was going to take it anywhere outside of Toronto, a city that I that I like and I enjoy being. I always loved Halifax. The people in Halifax were lovely.
It is beautiful. So I was like, at the very least, if I get no, I get to see Halifax. And that’s my favourite way to travel is for my art.
So luckily, I got more than one person. Not not many more, but yeah, I still got more than one person.
[Phil Rickaby]
But did you did you return to I think you did Orlando Fringe with that show and or did you do other fringes with that show?
[Kelly Taylor]
So the year after I got into other fringes, so I did New York Fringe, I did Orlando Fringe. And it was so funny because the show had kind of tanked in the other cities. It got the best review ever gotten in New York, actually.
But it’s still every fringe is weird. It’s set up differently. And, you know, I don’t know, it’s just it’s hard to plug it.
And then when I did Orlando, it was a different venue. It was like a venue outside of their normal venue. And it was downtown Orlando.
And people in Orlando, they don’t like to drive like it’s like how Orlando Fringe works is everything is pretty much at this place called the Orlando Shakespeare Center or Orlando Shakes. And it’s this beautiful old heritage building that they basically renovated into multiple rooms and theaters. So everything for the most part is there.
There’s free parking. There’s a couple other venues that are like within walking distance and everything’s labeled by colour. There’s a green venue, a red venue, yellow venue.
So they had inherited this new building, which they’ve used for in the winter, they do workshops in the winter, they do shows in the winter. So they tried for a few years to make that part of Fringe. So I was lucky to be in the first year of that.
And I was one of the shows that was in this new venue that, you know, they tried really hard. They had a shuttle bus that would take people to the venue. But then, you know, you kind of have to commit to the bit.
And there were a few diehards that did do it. There were some diehards that were like, my goal is to see every show. And they would hop on that shuttle bus and they would go to that venue and they would see all the shows there.
They would make a day of it. But yeah, unfortunately, a lot of people that I would try to plug this show and they’re like, oh, where’s it flying? I’m like, oh, it’s at the purple venue.
They’re like, oh. And I’m like, oh, okay, great. So you won’t be coming.
Lovely. But I had my mom with me, who’s like the best publicist. Her second time in Orlando.
She came with us as well when we did Orlando 10 years ago. So she was great handing out postcards being like, can I show? You need to come see it.
[Phil Rickaby]
Listen, you need when you’re flyering, you need any kind of thing that will work, anything at all. And, you know, it’s funny, the whole like that, the reaction to the purple venue when you already know that person’s not coming. I think I prefer the at a fringe.
Somebody go, oh, to the venue. Yeah. Yeah.
Not the show. Yeah. When I was in Calgary doing a Calgary fringe many years ago was the only city where you would hand somebody a flyer and they’d say, oh, no, I’m not coming to that.
Or or they would hand you back the flyer. It would be like, save the tree. And the tree’s dead.
[Hools Kay]
The tree’s dead. It’s here. It’s printed.
Leave me.
[Phil Rickaby]
The least you can do is like, take this. I don’t need to know you’re not coming. Take it.
I’ll walk away. You can drop it. You can put it in the garbage.
I don’t need to know. You’re not doing me any favors by telling me you’re not coming to the show.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Yeah. It was a long time ago, but I am still bitter about that.
Yeah. Yeah. You should be.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah. Yeah. I feel that way about Orlando because we had such a great time doing it the first time around that I can’t wait to go back.
And then, yeah, I was just like, OK, that was a thing. But I mean, like, it is what it is. I mean, everyone tries new things.
And, you know, I don’t you can’t hate on someone for trying to optimize more ways for artists to be able to get their art seen. It was unfortunate circumstances for me that like I didn’t live in the city. Luckily, I had a few connections anyways from being in the festival a few years prior to that.
But I mean, it is what it is. But the people that did see it, enjoyed it. And you just got to.
You don’t do for a string money. You don’t make you don’t know.
[Phil Rickaby]
No, you don’t. It would be nice to break even, though.
[Kelly Taylor]
But I feel like also when you’re travelling, though, it’s almost unless you’ve got a solid show where you’ve made the rounds, it’s almost impossible to break even when you.
[Phil Rickaby]
Oh, sure.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah. And like, you know, travel and like accommodations and living your you know, you might be in an Airbnb, but I mean, yeah, we had an Airbnb and we still didn’t.
[Hools Kay]
Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
Cook and think of my mom. My mom cooked for us because I think that’s the only reason she came. She didn’t want us to die of like starvation.
I mean, she was like a bunch of fucking millennials, like in a house together. Well, we were in our 20s. And while you were.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah, of course. Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
Still. Yeah. And my mom just knew better.
I was like, OK, it was some be a liquor diet. I mean, it still was a liquor diet, but it was a little bit. Remember who was sliding down the banister?
OK, wow. Wow. You’re just going to you’re just going to feel like you’re going to throw holes down the stairs like that.
[Hools Kay]
Yeah, for real.
[Phil Rickaby]
Wow.
[Hools Kay]
It’s a different time in my life. They were wild.
[Phil Rickaby]
I want to I want to ask, you know, every fringe is different. You know, every fringe is different. Every fringe has a different culture.
Every fringe is looking for something different. Some fringes are very adventurous and others want something tried and true. And unless you’ve been there before, you can find like a fringe mentor who’s been to all those places that can tell you like you want somebody to be able to go.
Montreal likes weird stuff, but they don’t mind if it’s if it’s kind of rough around the edges. Toronto wants it polished and perfect. And Winnipeg and Edmonton will see something that’s funny like that.
You need somebody to tell you that kind of stuff so that you know what you’re doing. Right. Did you have as you were embarking on your fringe adventure?
This will go to both of you, Kelly. Did you have anybody to give you the what’s what about the places you were going?
[Kelly Taylor]
I don’t think, Bill. I think last. I do things.
I say, this will be fun. I think what’s the worst that can happen? I just say, OK, let’s do this.
Yeah. I’m like driving across the country when I don’t drive. And my best friend has had her license at the time for less than a year.
But it’s fine. So, no, I was very fortunate that when I did Halifax Fringe, the second time I went to Halifax, the first time I went around, the people in Halifax were so lovely. They were like, you got a really good show.
Please come back. We’re not a hard fringe to get into, you know. And I had accidentally booked the theatre right before Halifax Fringe because they weren’t doing any advertising for their fringe.
So I had no idea if they were still doing a fringe when their fringe was. And this is after the pandemic. So maybe it folded.
I don’t know. So, yeah, unfortunately, my first time around hurt because of that. So, you know, our lovely tech was like, you’ve got a really good show.
I think people would really dig it. Please try again. So, you know, I didn’t have them as a mentor when I came back.
I kind of came back knowing that, like, OK, I’ve done the show before in the city. So I kind of used that leverage to kind of do marketing. And there were some people that saw the ads for it and were like, oh, like you, you were here last year and I missed it.
And I’m like, well, now’s your chance. And my lovely good friend Velva Duke was also doing a show in Halifax. It just so happened that we were both doing it at the same time.
So then it was nice to have like a buddy, you know, and. Yeah, they’ve done they’ve done a few different fringes as well, and they actually directed the show that day we went to Orlando, you know, they had no part in Thank You Acts, but it was just nice to have a friend. And I mean, they’re a mentor anyways, just like, you know, in the theatre community and comedy and whatnot.
They’re just one of my favourite humans. Um, so, yeah, and I didn’t have anyone. I knew no one in New York, like not a soul.
And in Orlando, I kind of had some friends from when I when we went a few years ago. Yeah. And I’ve kept in touch with when we went the first year we ended up Airbnb being with.
Yeah. So I’ll get an artist who was doing a show in the fringe that year. Really worked because it was like they already knew what they were doing and everything.
That’s so helpful. Yeah, they were anyone patrons pick. And this is mom magic.
I’ll actually just say my mom is is this magical being. So she was like looking into like looking booking the Airbnb and she found one and she was like, somebody who you guys can share with and she’s also apparently in the fringe. And apparently this woman usually rents out her Airbnb and just stay somewhere else.
But she’s like, I just am in a fringe this year. So I have to be there. So I love to cross promote.
So, yeah, she introduced us to a lot of people. We had a lot of really fun nights, the fringe tent with her and her group. And, you know, she put us in their program.
We put her in our program, although she didn’t need it.
[Hools Kay]
Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
They were they’re like a pole dancing group. They did a Rocky Horror picture. So the like horror.
Yeah, but like the Rocky Horror pole show. Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Oh, yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah. Right. Yeah.
Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. You don’t you don’t really need it. You don’t need anything more than than that.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah, it was great. Well, actually, funny enough, the the show that was in my venue that did well on the only show that did well was Shrek’s called the musical burlesque.
[Hools Kay]
Oh, I’ve been there.
[Kelly Taylor]
And they were in the room next to me. So there’ll be sometimes like I’m in the middle of my show and I’m talking about my first heartbreak and you hear people like. Okay, so I just took their top off.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. You know, it is it is good. I mean, being in Halifax with with Velvet, it’s really good to know somebody because when I was at the Halifax, this is like 2017, 2018.
I don’t know if it’s changed at all. There weren’t many opportunities to meet other performers because there isn’t like a free or anything like that. There’s no artist mixers, really.
So you kind of have to like accidentally run into each other and like find it. So there isn’t it isn’t like some of the other cities where you get to go to a place and like network with other artists.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah. I remember thinking not understanding that there wasn’t a communal area. And I thought maybe Neptune was that because I’m like, well, they have a bar to maybe people hang out.
And I think I remember asking, I think I was asking my tack. I was like, hey, do you want to hang out at Neptune? And he’s like, for what?
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
I like I like go grab a drink and hang out with people. And is that what people do here? And he’s like, no.
Oh, okay, cool. So I’ll just hang out in my hotel. Yeah.
Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. No, it’s pretty it’s good. In a way, it’s kind of sad to be a touring artist at the Halifax Ridge if you don’t already know people.
[Kelly Taylor]
Know people.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
But he was lovely. Like the folks there are are lovely when you meet people of mine. And there are plenty of people that I would, you know, plug my show to and they would either be like, oh, I already got tickets or yes, I’m planning it or I saw it or I’m trying to make it work.
So people were so lovely. And my best reviews were in Halifax and Halifax was so funny because I had rented the bus stop theatre when I had gone on my own. And when I got into Halifax Fringe, there was like a mix up on my venue.
So at first it was bus stop theatre. And I was like, okay, I love bus stop. Yes, we’ll say yes to this.
And then I get this email correction, maybe kind of like maybe a month or maybe two months in and you’re at the community centre. I was like, what’s the community room? And texting Velvet because they had done Halifax the year before as well.
So I was like, what’s the community room? Like I’ve been to the bus stop. Like, is it is there a window?
I don’t understand. Like, where am I performing? And they’re like, oh, it’s in the basement.
I’m like, they have a basement. And I’m Googling it. And I’m like, oh, my God, this looks like somewhere you have your Girl Scout meetings.
And I remember feeling I was being such a brat. I was feeling so sad because I’m like, I’d had a terrible run in New York and Orlando. I’m like, the only reason I was doing this was like, I really wanted to give it like one last, like push.
I’m like, this is Canadian. I don’t have to worry about the border. I can just pull the crap out of it.
It’s fine. And I think I remember feeling like, oh, my God, I’m performing in like a church kitchen. And that’s what it would feel like.
And so people would be like, are you excited for Fringe? I’m like, no. And I was still rad about it.
I’m like, I don’t, it’s just for me, it just didn’t look like theatre. And I, and whenever you tour also, you kind of, you don’t bring your, your set, the set that you design, you kind of have a condensed version of it. So I’m like, I’ve got a condensed version of my set.
I’m in a kitchen. Okay. But the magic of theatre, it’s like, after the first tech, I’m just like, okay, this is, this is, this is great.
And then people, people came and people liked it. And I thought the best review I’d ever gotten in my life. This girl came to see the show and she just raved about it.
And I was like, oh my God. I’m like, okay, well, this is why I create art. I don’t create it.
So I can, you know, be on a stage I created. So I can like show people my art and I can inspire people. It’s fine that I’m in a kitchen.
[Phil Rickaby]
I mean, this is the thing about, about fringe festivals is that if you’re touring, you have to be so flexible. You don’t know until you get there. What each, like, sometimes it’s like, Hey, we rehearsed this on a giant stage.
And the first time we performed at the stage was huge. And now we’re in a tiny box. So now we have to reblock the whole thing.
You just have to make changes on the fly.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah. Yeah. And I think that taught me so much as a performer.
I, I used to be so like, I want to be rehearsed. I want to make sure I know what I’m doing to like, touring by myself. Like when I was touring by myself, I did have Maddie the first time.
But after that, it was, it was just me, my mom, obviously, and, but she’s, she’s far from a director. But like, yeah, like rehearsals, are non-existent sometimes, depending on the tech you have as well. And depending on how well your tech goes, you’ve got like two hours of time.
And so, yeah, I, I had to do that show with like, tech going so wrong that I get no rehearsal time. And I’m like, so my first show is my dress rehearsal. But it teaches you a lot about improv.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Cool. So I had a question for you.
And we haven’t had the chance to talk about this because I haven’t really been able to sit down and talk with you since, since 2019, where you did Drink of Choice at the Toronto Fringe. Yeah. Where you were the only person I know who’s gotten a cease and desist from Disney.
Yes. Because who knew that the phrase, choose your own adventure, was a copyright that they would like, kill for?
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah. Yeah. I’m like, there has to be a bot looking out for it.
Because how the heck did they find this Fringe? Like, we’re not making money here. Like, you would know enough to be like, okay, we don’t need to send a cease and desist.
[Hools Kay]
It was a wild email to get from Fringe. And even the Fringe people who were working that year too, were like, we didn’t know how to respond to this. Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. That’s, I mean, that is why, first off, you’re like, I’m doing this thing. People are paying like, what, like $12 to come and see this show?
I’m a real threat to the copyright of choose your own adventure. But like, what was it like being inside that?
[Kelly Taylor]
I mean, because we didn’t have any actual contact with, I guess, whoever, it was through Fringe. Like, they went through Fringe who then got to, through my producer to me. And so I think we just started saying like, pick your own story.
And like, did it in a way that was like, this is stupid. But yeah, it didn’t end up being anything major. Like, we didn’t have to change our poster or like, remove anything from a website.
So I don’t really know what the end result was. Again, I felt like it might’ve just been some bot who was like, Hey, here’s our trademark being used, because there was never any like fallout or anything. It was, and it was like two shows left.
[Phil Rickaby]
Was there even, was there even any kind of, please, please respond and let us know that you’ve done something or was it just like, stop doing this?
[Kelly Taylor]
I think it was a stop doing this.
[Phil Rickaby]
Wow.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah. Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Wow.
[Hools Kay]
Yeah. Cause then we ended up remounting the show. So I assume that in the remount, we, we probably changed the wording or just didn’t say it was a choose your own adventures show, just like do.
But yeah, it just nothing ended up really be, I wish I had like the email framed or something, but it all went through Fringe.
[Phil Rickaby]
So that’s too bad. I would have asked for the email. I would have asked for the email.
There is, you remember the restaurant, the bar Betty’s yes. On, on King. Yes.
Originally Betty’s was called the Betty Ford. That was the original name until they got a cease and desist letter from the Betty Ford centre, which they printed, they blew it up, printed it huge and put it on the building. Oh, amazing.
For everyone to see. I got to frame that thing. I would have had that as people were coming in.
Yes. Like blow it up. It could be the poster.
[Hools Kay]
Got the little Mickey Mouse symbol and everything.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
I mean, at least he didn’t get stopped at the border. Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
The, the, the, the, that happening and then like taking that to, you know, you, you, you then remounted that show outside of Fringe. The whole thing, like from the cease and desist and all that sort of stuff, but then like the remount, what did you learn about Fringe producing and outside of Fringe producing?
[Kelly Taylor]
So I was very grateful to not produce it. Actually, I will say I, I did start producing it and brought in a producer, producer halfway through Fringe Sarah Angel, who is a Vancouver artist. Very talented and wonderful.
She produces a really great show, a comedic show out there in Vancouver.
[Hools Kay]
And she came in halfway through and took over the Fringe one.
[Kelly Taylor]
And we also got a production assistant, Rochelle Richardson, and I think that like the team really is what made it. And then, so when we did the remount, I was like, I’m not doing any of, I’m not doing any producing. That’s not happening this time.
[Hools Kay]
So please take it over. And I was like very grateful for not just Sarah and Rochelle, but like my stage manager, Jess, and obviously my director as well, like really just coming behind me. And I think that’s it.
[Kelly Taylor]
Like a lot of it is bringing in people who, you know, are going to be there for the show and like for the creation and the art that’s being made really made that a good experience for me. And it’s really about who you’re working with.
[Phil Rickaby]
Oh, absolutely. For sure.
[Hools Kay]
Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Kelly, you said something a little while ago and I want to come back to it. Okay. You said, I don’t think, I don’t, I just do.
Yeah. And the question I have is, I understand that you come from a family of literal clowns. Yes.
Is that where I don’t think I just do comes from? Is that something you were raised with or did you come to that later?
[Kelly Taylor]
I don’t think I was raised that way. I think definitely the weirdness is the family of clowns. So quite literally, my parents, back in the day, back in like the eighties, nineties, they had their own clown company.
My dad was in a clown band. My mom started clowning on the side. They found out it was a really lucrative business and they became so popular that they got their own clown business.
So they essentially became clown pimps and had other clowns working for them. Which is actually where I started. My mom would put me in her like little shows and stuff to save money on a babysitter.
I would, you know, she needed a Christmas elf for a parade. Here, put on this wig, put this makeup on. And I hated it as a kid.
I was like, Oh my God, I just want to be pretty. And now I’m like, fuck being pretty. It’s really weird.
So it comes back around full circle. But the not thinking I think just comes from, fuck it. Just do it.
Like I don’t care. I’m at the point, I started my own production company because no one was giving me the opportunities that I wanted or the type of roles that I knew I could do. And I was like, well, I’m just going to look for those roles myself.
And I started off before I started writing, I started looking for, for plays of, you know, that like local playwrights, you know, people that wanted their, their stuff being seen by people that maybe didn’t make the first table read. And, you know, you’re literally workshopping in three rehearsals. And, you know, and I moved to Toronto 14 years ago, thinking I’ll probably be home in six months.
Because everything, everyone told me that that’s what would happen. And I was like, well, whatever, fuck it, just do it. Like, I think that’s just my attitude is like, well, what’s the worst that can happen?
Because to me, like the worst has happened, you know, like, I’m not getting anywhere anyway. So what difference does it make if I create my own opportunity is if I didn’t get any fringes anyways. So if I book a, like a theatre in Halifax, and I take my show on the road, what’s the worst that’s gonna happen?
Like I have a show, may as well put it on, may as well let six people in Halifax see it. You know? So yeah, like, I mean, just it just comes from who the fuck cares, just do it, just write that thing you want to write, put it on, if you want to put on in a basement, if that’s all you can do, then like, you know, put it on here in your backyard, like, what is the worst that can happen?
Just do it. So I don’t think I think about consequences later, I think about like, oh, this could maybe not go right. Oh, well, too late.
Future Kelly’s problem. Yeah, yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
I have written down start clown business because I that like, like, I just think that apparently I didn’t think that was lucrative. But you know, hey, if that’s what it takes to get ahead in the business these days, I will start a clown business. Yeah, I think you’d be great.
It’s not a phrase that I think is spoken very often. Were you in the family business? Or did like aside from when you were like a kid?
Did you clown?
[Kelly Taylor]
And I think I’ve got this weird trauma. I will not I will, I will not be a clown. I would like I will to this day.
And my parents are fully retired from from that. My mom had the same wig for 20 years. And I think it has disintegrated.
And she knew that was it. She was like, when the weight disintegrated, it was time for her to retire. But yeah, no, I just I, I have this fear of like, balloon animals.
I don’t know, it’s weird. Because like, I think like, I was forced to do it when I was younger. But oddly enough, like, it’s actually how I got my start in the business.
Because I worked for another children’s entertainment company where I wasn’t a clown. But they licensed the rights to these like cartoon characters in these shows. And they would put on like little condensed stage versions of these shows.
And you would have like a backtrack and you would be like, and like you would have like choreographed dance routines, you would be kind of like miming this story. And you would have a human host to interact with the kids and the characters. And because you can’t tell from this podcast, but I’m very short.
I am five foot nothing. I get measured at roller coasters. I’m going to go through the McDonald’s drive thru.
They ask her, do your parents know? So I’m perfect for like mascot costumes. I’m perfect for like a Care Bear, or a My Little Pony or something like that.
So yeah, I got my start outside of the family business by doing a family adjacent. It was actually a family’s friend and she was like, oh, well, we need someone to play Snoopy. Can Kelly do it?
And I was like, okay, yeah, Kelly would love to sweat in a dog costume for six hours. But I’m performing, so it’s art.
[Phil Rickaby]
This is something I’m familiar with. I spent some time as a beloved children’s character in two instances, a TV Ontario famous character. Do you know Pat Silver?
I don’t know.
[Kelly Taylor]
Okay.
[Phil Rickaby]
No. I do remember doing a show. And the one thing they told us is like, if you learn to take nothing else, please do not throw up in any of the costumes.
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah, yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Continuing the show is not worth it. If you’re going to throw up, leave the stage, take off the head, do the business.
[Kelly Taylor]
I fell over once.
[Phil Rickaby]
When I, the head on the thing that I was wearing was very top heavy. So you have to be very well balanced. It was one show I was almost going to throw up and I was dry heaving after the scene that I was, the bit that I was in.
But I do not wish that on anybody. But it is an athletic bit of business to wear those outfits and keep them alive and have to do things to a backing track and mime the dialogue.
[Kelly Taylor]
And be entertaining for the kids, right? And not just be a stationed person. We did a meet and greet once after a show and it was, I think it was New Year’s Eve and it was so windy.
And the costume I had was like, like this, like, like a hot air, no pun intended, air balloon. Yeah. But it was a joke from the show.
But it was like, you like clicked this little thing together and it just inflated inside. I don’t know how to explain it. Like a hot air balloon kind of thing.
And so I was this inflated bear. And so it was very light and I couldn’t see out of it. Like the vision was awful.
And sometimes, I mean, children, I mean, I’m short, but I’m not as short as like a very little child, despite what people might think. So this one kid got so excited. They come running up to give me a hug.
I go over. And one of the guys who was there, he was the human host. And he was just there to kind of act as like a, like a guide for the meet and greets.
He’s like, all of a sudden I look over and Kelly’s on the ground. And then you hear, all I can hear is a woman being gentle with Captain Barnacles. Gentle.
And then there was another time we were doing a show and this guy treated it like an actual theatre. He had no idea what he was doing. And it was black, like the audience was black, like a theatre, except we can’t see anything.
We can’t see anything on, you know, out of these costumes. The lights are on us. The stage is like six feet high, because it was like in like a weird stadium.
This guy rented out some stadium in like New Brunswick or something or somewhere in Nova Scotia. And yeah, I’m like, I’m like two inches away from like falling off the stage. The human host had to like kind of keep looking over and he had to grab my hand to like guide me back.
Because it’s like, I know the choreography, I can do it. But like, I’m seeing the abyss in front of me right now.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
One wrong step could be deadly.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Coming back to Un (Captial F) Famous for a second.
Kools, you’ve shepherded this show with dramaturgical knowledge. And so you’ve helped Kelly to craft the show. And now you’re directing it.
Are there what has what your mind has changed the most since you first saw the script?
[Hools Kay]
I mean, we’ve had many versions of this. Yeah. Version three.
Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
I mean, I think there’s just like so much hurt to it, which like, and I said this to Kelly, and I’ll say this to other people, but she’s like the best joke writer I’ve ever met. She’s so funny. She’s so quick, with like, just bit like so quick on a page.
And so the jokes are really, really there. And then she works she works with Mellie, her co writer on this piece and them coming together and just being like, Hey, I just need to know like, why this character is doing this thing? Like what brings us?
Why do we care about this one person in this show? And just even those little things. And then all of a sudden, it just like flourished into something where you’re I would, I’m, you know, I just watch it.
And I was like, I love lavender so much. I’m just like, you’re I it’s such a genuine human person on stage. I think that’s what’s really grown since the beginning of this script is like seeing a real person.
Yeah, she’s definitely grown from where I think I had her to be more of a caricature. Which, which, you know, also, which is a lot of time. But no, definitely Mellie help flesh her out a bit.
And, you know, you see you see her vulnerable moments, which is challenging for me as an actor, because like I said, I, I excel at comedy. That is my thing. I like a quick joke.
I like being Woody. And holes has been great with like helping me get those moments of like, vulnerability. It’s like, okay, this is why you need to be real here.
Not everything’s a joke. I have to dig in it.
[Phil Rickaby]
This is a thing that makes it that that elevates theatre or a play from from sketch comedy, right? Is, is the fact that you can make an audience laugh, but you have to kind of earn that by giving them some kind of like, payoff, emotional vulnerability, things like that, without, that’s what elevates it from a comic, like a straight up like sketch show, or instead of comedy show. Yeah, yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
It’s also a very different audience with theatre. And although my background is in theatre, I’m because I, I, there was a time when I used to switch back and forth between sketch and theatre so much that like, I don’t think anyone knew what were to put me this, the comedy community would be like the theatre girl, the theatre community to be like, Oh, the comedy girl, because I’d be like, I’m doing a comedy show. Oh, I’m doing a play.
And I’m doing this. And because like, I do love comedy. I love the laughter.
Like, you know, I Tinkerbell needs applause to live. I need laughter to live. It is a it is a different audience.
A theatre audience can be very engaged and like just drawn to the story. Not to say that they don’t think things are funny, but it’s weird as like a comedian, I’ll be doing a show, a show like Thank U.S., which is full of zingers and full of like, you know, almost like a glorified standout, but there are a lot of real moments and it is a story. So people will be really engaged.
And I’m like, they didn’t laugh. But then after people will come up to me like, Oh my God, I loved it. Like, well, you didn’t laugh.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah, no, it’s kind of have to be able to sense the fact that they are smiling sometimes. Like, yeah, I remember years ago doing a play in the style of silent film, because we weren’t making noise. Sometimes the audience felt like they had to be asked to.
It was really helpful to have at least one or two people with big laughs and then they would give everybody permission to laugh. But yeah, afterwards, like people weren’t laughing, but they were like, you could see they were smiling. And that’s yeah, that’s enough, right?
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Yeah. God, you said something that I was I was really curious about.
But I want to talk about about writing with Mellie because as a writer myself, I find that a very solitary thing to do. But you are you’re you have a writing partner. How does that look for you as you’re writing?
Do you do you do you write something, set it to Mellie, Mellie writes it or you or do you write separately and share? Like, how does that process work?
[Kelly Taylor]
Different for each project. So I’ve known Mellie for years and I was primarily like a sketch comedy writer. I’m great with a POV, a premise and a joke.
This is what I’m good at. And for Thank You, Axe, it came about as I kept making these jokes about my dating life or just like dating in general. Like it just I was going on these dates.
I’m making these jokes. And back in the day, it was Twitter and Facebook. I’m putting online and people be like, oh, my God, if you were to show about this, I would come see it.
I’m like, OK. So like I would make these jokes and I had like a like kind of like the same with like Un (capital F) Famous where like I have like a like a premise and a vision of like, oh, this is what I want to be. I kind of had the jokes for Thank You, Axe.
Like I knew that I wanted to start in line to be they say that if a girl’s hot to crazy ratio is equal, then she’s worth putting up with. Well, judging by recent experience, I think I need to get hotter. So like I just had these in mind and I said to Mellie, I want to write a play.
But I don’t know how and she’s like, I’ll help you. I’m like, OK. So I kind because it was based on my life, like with autobiographical in a way, I kind of treated it like sketch comedy.
So I treated like every chapter in my life like a sketch. And so Thank You, Axe was really written primarily by me. Much to my hesitation, because Mellie was like, I don’t think you need me.
I’m like, oh, don’t leave me. And she’s like, no, I’m not going to leave you. But I think I think you’ve got this like this is your story to tell.
And then I had an idea for Thank You, Axe to have it be two characters, but both played by me. So I had the idea for it to be like we’re telling a story within a story. So you have I call her a theatre house.
I think Maddie calls her a teacher. She’s basically explaining to the audience the story about this girl named Violet and teaching you the history of men and love, essentially. And the girl takes you through her first crush, her first kiss, her first heartbreak, first time having sex, all these different first in a young girl’s life with like a comedic twist.
So Mellie was really great with coming up with the second character and having those like this character and writing her to be like an educational sort of, I don’t know, person, whether it’s a teacher or a host or whatever. And then so for Uncouple of Famous, I again didn’t know what I was doing. And I had the premise and I and I had like a skeleton of it.
And yeah, I I had like a skeleton of a play and I sent it to Mellie and I said, hey, this is my idea. I don’t know. You can tell me it’s garbage.
And so she read it. And then we sat down and we talked about different ideas. We talked about like more of a backstory, like who was saying like, you know, making Lavender a little bit more human and less less sketch comedy, I guess.
And, you know, giving the other character more of a character arc. And so it was a lot of back and forth with that. So it would be like I would make an edit and Mellie would make an edit.
We would talk about the edits. We would sometimes meet up together and discuss things. There were some things that were non-negotiable.
And I’m like, I’m bringing this joke back. I don’t care. She’s like, OK, like, it’s funny.
I just don’t get it. I’m like, you don’t have to get it. It’s fun.
It’s day. And that’s like the comedian in me. I’m like, I need the jokes.
So, yeah, both situations were a little bit different. I think Uncouple of Famous felt more collaborative because it was a fictional story and it wasn’t it was inspired by real life, but it’s not based on real life. I was never a soap opera star.
I did not get cheated on. I helped publicly anyways at the Met Gala. So, yeah, and it was just fun for us to kind of come up with these these characters and what they would be like and talk about those those ideas and stuff.
[Phil Rickaby]
Awesome. Now, this show is being performed at the Red Sandcastle Theatre in Toronto from October 8th to 11th. Yes.
One of my favourite things about that theatre and it sometimes catches people off guard is the intimacy of that space because the audience is so close. And sometimes people who haven’t been there but in that on that stage before don’t realize like exactly how close that audience is going to be. But I I really dig it.
I really dig being like like you because you can really feel the audience and their reactions to things. What drew you is that what drew you to the venue or or what is it that you like about that space?
[Kelly Taylor]
It’s really nostalgic for me. So oddly enough, Maddie and I met during auditions for a show we did in 2018 and we performed at the Red Sandcastle Theatre. And that show was magical and it was life changing.
And Maddie became one of my bestest friends. First day of rehearsal, our director gave us an improv exercise and me and Maddie got paired together and Maddie said, I feel like our characters would be best friends. I’m like, OK.
I think that just from I don’t know, from that moment on, Maddie and I just it’s just it’s such a it’s a love story. We became we became best friends. And then so when I was looking, people were looking to do a play festival last year.
So again, I had a crazy idea to put on a play festival because Maddie and I both didn’t get into fringe. I wanted to give Thank UX again, one last push. I kept saying that.
I’m like, I’m not done with the show, I guess, until I write something new. So we didn’t get into fringe. And I again said, fuck it.
Let’s do our own thing. And she’s like, our own festival? Like, yeah, why not?
Again, what’s the first thing gonna happen? Luckily, Maddie was a little more sensible this time and she said, let me look into grants. So she’s a fantastic grant writer, by the way, if anyone needs a grant, hit up Maddie Rose.
So we were very fortunate enough to get a grant for our festival. And so we were looking at venues. And I was like, what about the Red Sand Castle?
Like, I always loved that space. And and Eric is just so lovely. And we had such a magical experience doing our play festival last year.
That, you know, I remember feeling like I want to come back. You know, and Eric’s like, please do come back. You guys are great.
And I’m like, we will be back. Didn’t know we’d be back this soon, because we literally did our show last May. But you know, I don’t think so.
Yeah, it was it was the first choice. And I, as soon as I, I want to say finish the script, but I really didn’t finish the script. I just picked it up again.
And I said, I want to do a play. And I want to put it on. Let’s email Eric.
Hi, Eric, when do you have availability? Oh, Thanksgiving weekend sounds great. It’s blocked.
And I didn’t know it was Thanksgiving. Maddie’s like, that’s Thanksgiving weekend. I’m like, isn’t?
Well, come out and celebrate Thanksgiving with us. And he might be our theatre. That is that is the message here.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah.
[Kelly Taylor]
Screw Turkey. So yeah, it’s such a lovely space. And I’m Eric who manages the theatre is is just lovely.
And it’s so magical. And I’m so excited to be back. And I honestly can’t imagine doing the show anywhere else for the for the first time.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah, for sure. Is there and I’ll put this question to each of you, whoever wants to go first with this. Is there something that you are most looking forward to audiences discovering with this show?
[Kelly Taylor]
Oh, it holds though. Oh, um, yeah, I mean, maybe it’s just like perfect for what I’m experiencing in my current life. I’m just like, remembering that theatre can impact you personally, you know, like, just even through rehearsals and watching the process so much of what like the character lavender is going through.
And so much of her journey and her discovery feels very, very personal for me with the current status of what I’m dealing with. So even just sitting here and being like, Yeah, I don’t have to give up on my dreams. Yeah, I just because someone killed my baby of seven years.
That doesn’t mean that I don’t ever do art again. I can go do stuff. And so just I think I’m excited for people to like be inspired by just you know, and it’s art.
[Hools Kay]
And that’s kind of why we do it. But yeah, that’s what I’m excited for.
[Phil Rickaby]
For sure. I think Kelly, how about you?
[Kelly Taylor]
Yeah, I would say things similar to wolves. I am. I want people to walk away feeling like, yeah, maybe I will write that thing.
Oh, I wanted to try this. Maybe I’ll pick up that guitar and finish that song I was working on 10 years ago. Maybe I’ll finish that script I was working on.
Maybe I will do my own play festival. Yeah, just just that. And I think for me as an actor, I’m terrified.
But I’m excited to see people see a little bit more of a vulnerable serious side to me. Like she’s still a very fun loving character. She’s got all her funny, fun moments.
But in the heart of the show, she definitely shows she kind of takes the mask off a bit. And she’s just like, well, this is this is who I am, which is something I don’t do often. I typically steer away from serious rules.
So, yeah, I’m excited for people to see me do something a little bit more vulnerable.
[Phil Rickaby]
Nice. Yeah. Well, Kelly Hools, thank you so much for joining me.
I really appreciate it. Looking forward to Capital F on Capital F famous.
[Hools Kay]
Yes. Thank you for having us. It’s great talking with you.
[Phil Rickaby]
Thank you so much for listening to this episode. I hope you enjoyed it. If you did and you’re on YouTube, like this episode, leave a comment so that I know that you were here and hit that subscribe button and the bell icon so that whenever a new episode comes out, you get notified that a new episode is available.
If you’re listening to the audio version, do make sure that you are subscribed. If you’re not already go to your favourite podcast app, search for stageworthy and hit the follow button. That way, every time a new episode comes out, it’ll download directly to your device and you won’t even have to go looking for it.
Next week on the podcast, I will be talking to Veronica and Annie, the creators of the show Monks. Now, this show was a sellout hit at the Toronto Fringe a couple of years ago. It’s sold out.
It’s run, I think it was at the Assembly Theatre last year and it is coming up at the Terragon Theatre and I cannot wait not only to talk to see that show because I’ve missed out because it was sold out. I’ve missed out every opportunity prior to now to see that show, but also to talk to the people who’ve created it. It is a wild ride and you’re going to love it too next week on Stageworthy.
