Iain Moggach
About This Episode:
This week on Stageworthy, host Phil Rickaby is joined by Iain Moggach, former Artistic Director of Theatre by the Bay in Barrie, Ontario. In this thoughtful conversation, Iain shares his journey from actor, administrator, and ultimately artistic director, reflecting on what it means to build theatre outside of a major city centre. He speaks to the unique challenges and opportunities of working in Barrie, and the importance of creating space for regional stories.
This episode explores:
- The role of mentorship and community in his career path
- The challenges of running a theatre company outside major urban centres
- Building partnerships and engaging new audiences in Barrie
- The importance of perseverance, adaptability, and curiosity in theatre-making
Guest:
🎭 Iain Moggach
Iain Moggach is an award-winning theatre producer, director, and performing arts educator based in Barrie, Ontario.
Iain was the Artistic Director of Theatre by the Bay from 2018-2024, where he received numerous awards including the Barrie Business Award for ‘Young Professional of the Year’ in 2019, and the Barrie Arts Award for ‘Contribution to the Community’ in 2024. Some highlights of his time there include launching the Simcoe County Theatre Festival, expanding the company’s Indie Producer Co-op into a national program, and commissioning several world premieres including ‘Icemen’ by Vern Thiessen, as well as new plays by Chloé Hung and Colleen Murphy.
As a director, Iain has directed professional theatre productions in seven cities across Canada, working in diverse styles including musicals, Shakespeare, contemporary drama, historical storytelling, and world premieres of new Canadian plays. Most recently, his production of Vern Thiessen’s ‘Bluebirds’ at Theatre on the Ridge received tremendous acclaim from critics and audiences.
As a theatre educator and mentor, Iain has developed programs for emerging directors and producers, facilitated workshops for arts organizations, and championed the growth of regional theatre across Ontario. His work reflects a deep commitment to the future of Canadian theatre and to building inclusive, supportive spaces for the next generation of performing artists.
In the last year, Iain has also found himself working as a Consultant; supporting organizations such as the Huronia Symphony Orchestra, the Kingston Theatre Alliance, and Art and Water Cultural Group with strategic growth.
Connect with Iain
📸 Instagram: @imoggach
🌐 Website: http://www.imoggach.com
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Transcript
[Phil Rickaby]
Hello, welcome to Stageworthy. I’m Phil Rickaby, the host and producer of this podcast. Stageworthy is Canada’s theatre podcast, and on this show, I talk to people who make theatre, some of whom you’ve heard of, and others I think you really should learn about.
On this show, I talk to people who make theatre, whether they’re directors, writers, actors, producers, whatever it is, as long as they’re making theatre, I’m talking to them. If you stay around to the end of the show, you’ll get a little preview of who’s on the show next week, as well as some other little tidbits of information. Today, I’m talking with Iain Moggach.
Ian was the Artistic Director of Theatre by the Bay from 2018 to 2024. He is also a director, and he’s directed many different productions. Most recently, Bluebirds at Theatre on the Ridge, which received tremendous acclaim from audiences and critics.
I really enjoyed this conversation, and I hope you do too. Here’s my conversation with Iain Moggach. Iain Moggach, thank you so much for joining me.
I really appreciate you making some time for me. You have just closed Verne Thayson’s Bluebirds. Tell me about that show, and how did you come to be working on that?
[Iain Moggach]
Yeah, so for those that aren’t familiar, Bluebirds is a really gorgeous three-hander, 90-minute play by Verne Thiessen about three Canadian nurses in World War I, the Bluebirds referring to their nickname that they were given because of their iconic blue uniforms. I’ve been a huge fan of Verne Thayson’s work for a long, long time. I remember seeing Shakespeare’s Will when I was 16 at the Stratford Festival and thinking, wow, this guy is amazing.
His work has always been one that I’ve kept an eye on. Then in 2023, I got to direct and commission a world premiere of Iceman by him, which was really cool. So as I was thinking about what shows I wanted to do for this really wonderful company called Theatre on the Ridge in Port Perry, Bluebirds came to mind.
Just because it’s so concise, it’s a great story. As well, it’s a great opportunity for three female, youngish performers, which I know that they typically love to hire there. So it was just this perfect confluence of all these different factors coming together and just ended up being a really amazing experience.
[Phil Rickaby]
I love learning about new theatre companies, theatre companies that I haven’t heard of. There are all kinds of great small companies in small towns or mid-sized towns all over Canada, and I’m not familiar with Theatre on the Ridge in Port Perry. So I’ll ask an almost ignorant question.
Is that a new company? How did you come to work with them?
[Iain Moggach]
It’s a great question, actually. They’ve been around for over a decade now, actually. Interestingly, their first production was Vimy by Vern Teason, which is sort of the sister play to Bluebirds back, I think, in 2013-ish, 2014.
I’ve actually been aware of them for a little while. The first thing that I did when I was out of theatre school at George Brown was Landon Doak and I did a musical version of Romeo and Juliet in the old Flame Brewery in the middle of Port Perry. That’s when Carrie, who’s the artistic director there, became aware of me and aware of my work.
We ended up doing this week-long directing workshop in Stratford through Theatre Ontario together, and we just kind of kept in touch for many years. And then, yeah, when I left Theatre by the Bay, she was one of the first people to give me a call to say, hey, let’s collaborate. Let’s find a way to make this work.
And I hadn’t seen much of their work, but I knew, of course, of the great impact that it was having. I love Port Perry as a town. This is a really cute town by the water, and they’ve just been doing great stuff.
But they are really like a rural theatre company. The actors, when they’re billeted, are often on these farms in the middle of nowhere. It’s a really unique place to work.
And over the last few years, they’ve been working under this gorgeous tent that they got. It’s sort of like a pandemic, we’re going to do outdoor theatre, but let’s protect people from the rain investment. And it’s actually a fantastic place to work.
It worked really well for the show. And yeah, they’ve fostered great audiences there. And artists work with them year after year after year, which I think really speaks to the community that Carrie’s inspired and the quality of employment and work that they do there.
[Phil Rickaby]
And great things happen under tents. The Stratford Festival got its start under tents. And I like the idea that some of the things that we started doing during the pandemic have sort of held over, and people have kind of got attached to them.
The cafes on the streets, we’re keeping those. And tents for theatres, I think that’s amazing too.
[Iain Moggach]
Absolutely. I mean, there’s something so unique and powerful and almost primal about it, right? With Bluebirds, because of course the shows were in the evenings, the way that the sun would set would actually impact the lighting on the show.
And so there’s these beautiful points later in the evening performances where these long shadows would be kind of cast and the actors would be naturally lit and stuff. And it just added this really powerful quality to it. And then once the show is done and you’d leave the tent, there you are looking out at this gorgeous field with these extraordinary sunsets.
One of the actors ended up just taking photos of the sunsets every single night because they were breathtaking each time in different ways. Yeah, I really loved working there. I love working outdoors.
I love working under tents. I agree, more tents.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah, for sure. Now, you were Artistic Director at Theatre by the Bay in Barrie from 2018 to 2024. That’s a good stint as Artistic Director.
And some people might not really be aware of the work that Theatre by the Bay does. So give me a little bit about Theatre by the Bay.
[Iain Moggach]
Sure. So Theatre by the Bay was actually founded back in 2001 by Larissa Mayer, who people may know, great big casting director based in Toronto now. And the idea was Shakespeare under a tent by Barrie’s waterfront.
I know, it all comes back to tents. But you know, I think the reality of tent life caught up with them. And also the mandate ended up needing to change a bit.
There was a stint into musicals, kids shows, things like that. And then when Alex Doe, who is the former Artistic Director, and myself got involved, we really started asking, what do Barrie audiences need? And what can we do that would be really different and significant?
Because of Barrie’s really odd location, where it’s close enough to Toronto for a lot of people, but it’s also kind of an island in and of itself. So you could access some of the best Shakespeare, some of the best musicals just two hours-ish away if you got terrible traffic, right? And that’s fine for some people.
So what we ended up focusing in on was this idea of doing original work about the local area. And that was something that really took off in a huge way. People loved it.
It was a really great way to sort of examine local history, but also sort of contemporary narratives and themes in a way that felt accessible and important. And I loved it. I mean, it was the reason I bought in so hard right away and ended up attracting all these different, interesting people.
So when I became Artistic Director, I really doubled down on the idea of bringing playwrights, especially from the outside, to look at Barrie through sort of a magnifying glass and find what sort of sticks out to them. So that’s how we ended up getting Vern Thiessen to write Iceman, which was about the ice harvesting industry. And he wrote this, I don’t know if you’ve had a chance to read it, but it’s like a three-hander thriller set in this hut in Innisfil.
And it’s all about the ice industry. And it’s fantastic. And then we had Chloe Hung writing a play for us.
We had Colleen Murphy writing a play for us. And also, of course, because of our local focus, we ended up fostering all these great playwrights. We had Zygwin Mixamong write a play for us, Trudy Romanek.
So the momentum was really carrying on. And that’s what really powered it through for me to have been there from almost, well, fall of 2015 all the way until fall of 2024, was just that I could see the momentum. I loved the work.
I saw the impact. And it was just, it felt very special and important.
[Phil Rickaby]
I think one of the things that I find interesting, or almost not, interesting is not the right word, because I’m thinking about the fact that, as you said, Barrie is two hours away from Toronto, depending on traffic. And yet so few people from Toronto ever experience what is happening in the scene in Barrie. Just like, you know, there’s interesting things that happen in Hamilton.
It’s an hour away. But most people in Toronto don’t get to experience it. The transit time tends to keep people away.
And I really think that, that in a way, we’re all missing out on these wonderful pieces of theatre that are taking place not so far away. But because of travel, we’re sort of denying ourselves that.
[Iain Moggach]
Oh, the number of times I have gone on, you know, rants, especially once I’ve had a few drinks in me, about the transit situation to some of these places. Like, yeah, I mean, in an ideal world, there’d be a train every hour, especially in the summer, right? Like, that just would make so much sense.
But yeah, just the absolute lack of public transit infrastructure, it has an impact on everything. I mean, Barrie is, like, especially in the summer, Barrie is a gorgeous place to go. There is amazing art that happens here.
I mean, Theatre by the Bay is just one of the companies. Like, there’s also Talk is Free, which continues to sweep the Doras, right? And has actually started to just bring its work into Toronto for people to see it, right?
So it is, it’s incredibly frustrating. And I mean, as you sort of mentioned, it speaks to a much larger issue, which is the lack of eyeballs and recognition of the work that happens outside of Toronto or any of those sort of major urban centres. And in a country that’s, I don’t know how many kilometres long, thousands of kilometres long, for the fact that, you know, unless you do work in, what, five, six cities, it’s just not really recognised in a meaningful way, boggles my mind and seems really antithetical to what we as a nation should be looking at in terms of national identity and these kinds of things.
[Phil Rickaby]
I mean, listen, we could get into the whole idea of how we don’t value art as part of the national identity. And when we’re talking about nation-building projects, we’re talking about shipping and trade barriers and pipelines, and we’re never talking about the arts, which is, that’s not how you build a nation. You build a nation through the arts, through storytelling.
But one of the things that I agree with is transit. I don’t know if it’s still the case, but I know it used to be that Barrie had a train, but it went to Toronto in the morning and from Toronto in the evening. So if you were taking the GO, that was it.
If you wanted to get to Barrie in the morning, or you wanted to go back to Toronto from Barrie, it was GO bus, or that’s it. The transit situation in Ontario was pretty bad.
[Iain Moggach]
It’s so terrible. And that basically is the case now. It’s just, it’s so horrific.
And I remember when I first moved to Barrie, it didn’t take me more than a few weeks to go, what do you mean there’s no train? What do you mean the last train’s at seven o’clock in the morning? That’s crazy.
That’s completely crazy. Yeah, it is. It’s a massive, massive issue.
And I mean, it’s summertime now. There’s a million cars that go on the 400 every summer, people driving to and from cottages, to and from work and stuff like that. You’d think that investing in mass public transit to Barrie, which is really at the epicenter of so many different places that you can go, would be a much bigger priority than it is.
And I tell politicians, anytime I see them, especially at the provincial level, anytime I see them, that they’ve got to really get into that. And they say, oh yeah, we’ve been working on it. This is a thing.
Transit’s very important to us. And it’s like, where’s the proof?
[Phil Rickaby]
Listen, transit is not as important to them as they don’t say that it is, but they just want to make more highways, right? Dig a tunnel to get more highway space. And it’s just like, just give us buses, trains, give us ways to travel around this province.
We don’t even have Greyhound anymore, right? You can’t just jump on a bus to go to these small towns anymore. They’re underserved.
Anyway. Wow, I didn’t think that was going to happen. Transit was the thing that was going to get me going.
[Iain Moggach]
Well, anyone who knows me, who will listen to this interview will not be surprised at all that I spent five minutes of my theatre interview on a podcast talking about transit, but yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
The next we should talk about is Burrough Theatre. Tell me, what is Burrough Theatre?
[Iain Moggach]
Sure. So Burrough Theatre, it started as a little bit of like a passion project. So when I was the executive director of Theatre by the Bay, I was desperate to be creative.
I couldn’t stand just writing grants and raising money. I needed to make art. I am an artist, you know, gosh darn it.
So my then girlfriend of the time, now wife, Marissa and I decided, hey, you know, like, because back in the very early days of my sort of producing life, I did shows in backyards in Toronto. I was part of that sort of 2015 wave of backyard shows. So we, so, you know, we, we have a great backyard here and we have lots of talented friends that, you know, needed work because another little facet of Barrie and Simcoe County more generally is that there’s no indie theatre at all.
There’s professional, there’s like a couple professional companies and there’s community theatre and there’s absolutely nothing in the middle. So we have all these really talented people that were doing stuff for free, you know, maybe they didn’t go into theatre professionally anymore or whatever, but like they’re really talented. So anyway, so we went to Flying Monkeys Brewery in downtown Barrie and had a few drinks and then we were like, let’s just do a Midsummer Night’s Dream in our backyard.
We’ll hire all our friends. We’ll have a great time and just see what happens. And that show completely sold out, like multiple performances.
There was so much goodwill. It ended up launching all these backyard and sort of unique space things across the county and it just really took off. And then in the second year we did Macbeth and one of the audience members who attended Midsummer in the first year worked for this very, this really fancy private resort called Friday Harbor.
And she said, hey, can I buy your production of Macbeth to do at our fancy crew? Like, oh my gosh. So yeah, so we ended up doing Macbeth, a few performances in our backyard, took it to this really fancy resort and it was just like, I think this is a thing.
Like I’m also someone who’s always tried to be extremely entrepreneurial. And so when I saw opportunity and knock-in, I answered. So yeah, so we did that.
And then another audience member who attended both shows ended up being part of this organization called Camp Hill that works with adults with disabilities primarily. And they, and she was like, we have this gorgeous hall out in Angus that is very underutilized. We’d love for you to start bringing your shows there as well.
And, and so we had, of course, plans for 2020. We know how that all went. We were going to do Merry Wives of Windsor.
And, and then, you know, a few years later, I didn’t need to do Burrought stuff because I was the AD. I was doing all these projects I cared about. My wife ended up going more into like dance and stuff for a while.
Anyway. And then, so, you know, as I was leaving Theatre by the Bay, I was sort of thinking about like, what are some things that I could kind of do around here that would, you know, help me keep busy in the area so I don’t have to commute for everything I do, that kind of thing. Anyway, so I reached out to the Camp Hill people.
We sat, we went for coffee. And then they were like, we’re still really interested in you doing stuff there. So we ended up having this great chat.
And then we sort of concluded that Burrought would be the resident theatre company of this hall in the woods that they give us for free, as long as we promise to activate it and do workshops and stuff. So it was just this like perfect synergy of we they have a space. They need programming.
We have programming. And now we’re collaborating on grants. We’re going to do a little pilot project in the fall of an adaptation of The Seagull that I’ve been working on and stuff.
And it’s just, it’s a really exciting moment and an example of, yeah, that, you know, even though I’m done with Theatre by the Bay, I still have more to give to this area. And I’m really excited about what the future holds for it.
[Phil Rickaby]
Well, you live there, you should, you should want to give to that community, right?
[Iain Moggach]
You live… You’d think, yeah. You’d think people would want to do that.
But yes, yes, I agree. But you know, like, I will just say this, my end at Theatre by the Bay was messy. And part of that messiness was that I had felt very burnt out by just the years of work and all the slogging and everything.
And so I wasn’t sure if I had much juice left in me to give to this, this place that I’d given really a third of my life to, right? But this came about, and it felt like I do. And I’m excited about it.
And there’s a lot of community that is still really excited about what I can do here.
[Phil Rickaby]
So, yeah. Nice. Nice.
Yeah. And I’m sure, I mean, do we, do we, you mentioned this space in the woods, it must be gorgeous in the fall when the leaves start to turn. What a time to be doing a seagull.
[Iain Moggach]
Absolutely. I know it’s gonna, I mean, it’s same with, it’s kind of like under the tent, right? Like, I’m a big believer that the atmosphere and location can and should really play a large part in the production itself, if it can.
There should be a dialogue there. And maybe that’s tied back to my, like, backyard Shakespeare days in Toronto, too. But location and story are so interwoven.
And so, yeah, like, you know, I imagine people driving up to the hall, yeah, the leaves changing color. And as they go into this space that’s, like, warm and inviting, and hearing this very minimalist, but, you know, hopefully very moving story that not a lot of people in the area know before. Like, we kind of take it for granted, but there’s gonna be a lot of people, I bet, that don’t know the story.
And that’s a really wonderful opportunity and a big responsibility, too.
[Phil Rickaby]
The idea that we know the end of these classic stories, right? We know how they go. That is a inside theatre kind of thing, right?
I remember many years ago, I was talking, I don’t know, I was on, like, Facebook or something, and I mentioned how Macbeth ends. And somebody was like, spoilers. And I was like, this plays 500 years old or more.
Like, what do you mean, spoilers? But we take it for granted that we know the end of the story. I’ve heard that at the end of Hadestown, you know, many people don’t know the story of Orpheus and Eurydice.
And so, when the end of that happens, there are audible gasps in the audience. Like, those are the audiences that, like, I really want to bring out to this kind of thing. Like, if you don’t know how this goes, boy, do we have something for you.
[Iain Moggach]
Absolutely. I mean, and, you know, hopefully, even with those stories that are well known, you find a way to make it feel kind of new again. But you’re right.
I mean, honestly, that’s part of the reason that I’ve done so much and love doing new work, right? Is that, like, they are not going to know it from the beginning, even those that are extremely, you know, familiar with theatre and stuff. But, yeah.
And I think, like, that is another part of working in a regional community, right? Is, yeah, the things we kind of take for granted are brand new. I mean, when we launched Burrowed, like, the idea of Shakespeare in a Backyard was like, what?
Like, theatre doesn’t have to be in a professional theatre space. It’s like, yeah, theatre can happen anywhere, right? That’s one of the great things about it.
And, yeah. And so, you just got to be the first to do it.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Yeah. Let’s step back for a minute, because I really want to hear from you about your theatre origin story.
How did you get into theatre? How did you get into directing? What is your origin story?
[Iain Moggach]
Sure. So I was a theatre kid from an extremely young age. I was the star of my kindergarten play.
And, you know, that was sort of how that all began. I did lots of drama camps and stuff. I’m from Ottawa originally.
So a lot of drama camps in Ottawa. And went to the arts high school in Ottawa, Canterbury, as well. And it was just, it was something that I loved to do.
Especially, you know, when I was younger, all my guy friends were really, like, sport people. Like, there’s so much soccer and stuff. And, like, I didn’t mind it.
But theatre was sort of a space where I could, I felt more myself. I met interesting people that, like, I wouldn’t have met through my, you know, grade four class. It much more, you know.
So it was just, and I was very creative. You know, I didn’t, I liked school, but I wasn’t necessarily, like, an A plus student all the time. But it was, it was where, but theatre was where I really shone.
And my parents also worked that out pretty quickly. And so, yeah, when I went to, and also, I got, like, very competitive about it at a young age. Like, I was reminiscing with a friend that, anyways, I was looking, I was at my parents’ house, and I found this, like, old headshot of myself when I was 14.
And I said to this friend of mine, and she was like, yeah, I remember that guy. He told me once, when I first met him, that he was going to destroy me in Shakespeare. I just, whatever.
So I was, you know, like, I just was very competitive about it. I took it really, really seriously. And then, yeah, and then at Canterbury, I got to flex a lot of muscles.
Like, I did some set painting and things like that. And yeah, and then I found directing, I think it was in grade 11. And I knew I’d like it right away.
Like, I just knew I’d like it because I had done, like, a lot of leadership camps and stuff. I liked being in charge. I liked seeing the big picture, that kind of thing.
So yeah, I got into that as soon as I could. And I really did like it. And then I was one of the assistant directors of our grade 12 class.
We did a show called The Triangle Factory Fire Project, which was this, like, massive collective-y kind of piece about the Triangle Factory Fire in New York. Like, what a grad show to do in grade 12. Anyway, it was awesome.
It was so much fun. And we also, at the time, we also had to do these things called director scenes, which were, like, you had 20 minutes to kind of direct something. You had to find your cast and choose the piece and stuff.
It was so cool. And yeah, and I did a piece that I was really proud of. And my drama teacher said, Ian, you have a director’s mind.
So I was like, oh, okay. So that was very validating. And then, yeah, and then I tried to get out of theatre.
After grade 12, I tried to go more sort of the academia route. My dad’s an academic, my mom’s an English teacher. So that felt like, you know, a good sort of other path for me.
But I didn’t like it at all. Did you feel like that was something you had to do? Or, like, what was pushing you to do that?
Good question. I don’t think it was. I mean, I don’t know.
I guess there was just sort of the knowledge that the life was going to be really hard. And I wanted to see if I could do something that wasn’t, like, as poverty-inducing, I guess, on some level. But yeah, then I tried it.
And I was like, oh, I don’t really like writing essays that much. Like, I’m pretty good at it. Turns out, you know, yeah.
So I went to Carleton. Oh, I did a one-year program at King’s College in Halifax. And then I left and went home.
And then I went to Carleton. And I was miserable. And then I got into the theatre company at Carleton.
I was, like, working with them. And the way I used to describe it is that, like, my soul clicked back into place. It was like chiropractic.
And then suddenly I was myself again. And it was like, okay, well, this is what I’m meant to do. So I was, like, Mercutio.
I was Oedipus. I directed a show. I stage-managed a show.
I did marketing for shows. I built sets. I just was all in on this theatre company at Carleton called Salk & Buskin.
And then once, as I was starting to graduate, it was like, okay, I got to apply for theatre schools. So went to George Brown, thanks to Peter Wilde, who I did, like, a course with. And actually, interestingly, on the first night of George Brown, we went to the pub, which you do.
And one of my classmates came up to me and she was like, I have a theory about you. And I was like, okay. She was like, you’re a director.
And for those who know George Brown, it’s like there’s no theatre directing at all, right? It’s pure acting, right? So for the fact that she knew right away that I was a director as well was pretty surprising.
And then I ended up actually being able to do a lot of directing while I was there, because people caught on to that. But anyway, that’s it. Yeah.
So that’s my origin story.
[Phil Rickaby]
When you were at George Brown, was Peter still teaching there? Was he teaching at that point?
[Iain Moggach]
He was. Yeah, he just did. At the time, it was just a third year.
Oh, God, was it third year? Third year or second year text analysis class. Oh, no.
Was it third year? Oh, gosh. This is terrible.
But it all blurs together. It was so long ago. But yeah.
So and we did James Joyce’s Ulysses, which was what a text to analyze.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah.
[Iain Moggach]
Yeah.
[Phil Rickaby]
When I was at George Brown, he was the head of acting. So it was quite the experience. And at that point, was it at the Young Center or was it?
It was. Yeah.
[Iain Moggach]
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
It was at the Young Center. Actually, that was honestly one of the reasons I wanted to go there. That was kind of why it was my top choice was like, soul peppers in the building.
You know, the Young Center is so cool. You know, I loved being surrounded by all this brick and stuff like my other option, because I didn’t I knew I didn’t want to do another degree. So like my other option, I think, was Studio 58 in Vancouver, which is like a good program, but it’s in like a basement.
It’s not right. You know, so the majesty of being in the Young Center every day was was a huge draw for sure.
[Phil Rickaby]
Did it live up to it?
[Iain Moggach]
Oh, for sure. I mean, I honestly think that the fact that I went to university first was probably a really. Well, I knew I know it was a very, very smart decision, because if I knowing like 19 year old Ian, if he had been there, I would have crashed for sure.
[Phil Rickaby]
But it was interesting because the thing when Peter Wilde was the head of acting, he always used to because we were all like 18, 19 years old going into theatre school. And he constantly said, I wish you were older, I wish you were older. And, you know, he’d say, if you would all just go away and come back to me in five years, everything would be wonderful.
And we’d be like, shut up, old man. But but there’s there is something about coming in that program with some maturity under your belt.
[Iain Moggach]
Absolutely. And, you know, because it just demands such a rigor that like most 18 year olds and 19 year olds and 20 year olds just don’t have a lot of practice at, you know. And also because I knew that like, OK, well, I tried something else.
I don’t like that other thing. So this is it. Like going in with that attitude of like this is what I’m going to do and I’m going to see this all the way through and take it as seriously as I possibly can, I think really did set me apart.
And also like the degree that I did was in humanities and history. So going into George Brown, which was so text based, they would be like, there’d be references to like Dante or whatever. And I go, oh, yeah, yeah, I know Dante.
Like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I know all these references and stuff, which which and yeah, and like his and knowing how to analyze text and like, you know, and and things like that did really feed into my time there. Yeah, really good, really good times.
Like tough as hell, tough as hell, for sure. But I wouldn’t have I wouldn’t change my experience there for anything.
[Phil Rickaby]
I did want to ask you about you said you basically went to two universities for a brief period of time. Yes. And I was curious if they had it when you were like thinking academia, is it for me?
Did you go to the first school? It didn’t work out. And you just thought, like, oh, it’s the school that’s the problem.
That is exactly what I thought.
[Iain Moggach]
I was like, oh, I got to get out of here. Like, yeah. I mean, also, I don’t know.
Being 18 is a really hard like 18 to 19 can be a really hard year for some people. And, you know, I had a lot of mental health things going on and like, you know, way too much freedom all of a sudden and stuff. So, yeah, but I but I did equate it with I have to get out of this school.
And also like Halifax is a great town, but it’s dark and rainy and snowy and like and I missed my friends and my old friends and stuff like that. I did meet some really good people like I met Chloe Hung there, for instance, who we ended up sort of working together and stuff. But yeah, I did equate it with with the school and then moving home, not really knowing kind of where to go from there, getting to this program at Carleton that was similar, but like took a bit more time and allowed me to do more history rather than like philosophy or religion and stuff was a net positive.
And then, yeah, getting back into the theatre company is really what propelled me to finish the degree.
[Phil Rickaby]
You described yourself as someone who’s followed an unconventional path. Is that the path like going to the is that academia to theatre school or what is the unconventional path that you sure see yourself on?
[Iain Moggach]
Yeah, well, I mean, I so I I just graduated George Brown. OK, this is 2015. I just graduated George Brown.
I was doing Shakespeare in Backyards and musicals and Shakespeare at Port Perry and stuff like that. And then I was offered this job at Theatre by the Bay of being the general manager and then executive director. And like for a 25 year old to sort of find himself as the head of this like charity, not for profit organization, I think is a little unconventional, certainly.
I mean, if I’d been in that if I’d been a board member in that board meeting and Alex Doe had said, I want to bring in this this guy. That did this like indie producer training program with us. And I’d been like, OK, well, is he is he is he trained in anything?
No, he’s an actor. Oh, OK. Does he is he good at math?
No. Is he OK? Is he from here?
No, he’s from Ottawa, then Toronto. OK, does he know anything about charity, not for profit governance? Well, no.
OK, and so this is the guy that you want to bring in to help theatre by the bay at this like really tumultuous moment? Yes. Like I would what I would do to have been a fly in the room during that conversation.
[Phil Rickaby]
Do you have any idea what the selling point was, like how he managed to convince them?
[Iain Moggach]
I mean, I think. The boards of directors and this is whatever, but boards of directors can go one of three ways. The first is that they just go, sure, whatever, and just let the leadership do whatever they want.
The second way is that they go, we’re in control, we’re the professionals, we’re the real people, and we’ve got to get these artists in line. Right. And then there’s the third way, which is sort of the golden mean where like, you know, everyone understands what their job is.
And I think it was a lot of the first where Alex was like, I want to bring in this guy. And they were like, OK. And then that was kind of that.
[Phil Rickaby]
It is interesting to go from and I don’t think that happens very often that somebody goes from a conservatory acting program to arts administration without any kind of like.
[Iain Moggach]
No, I mean, it’s in that exactly I wasn’t like the head of social media or like, you know, the assistant to whatever it was like, no, you’re the guy who’s going to raise, you know, tens of thousands of dollars.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Can I ask you about because you spend a little while in the arts administration field and you mentioned like like feeling a little bit like you needed the performance aspect, which is why you sort of are doing things with with Theatreboro and or theatre. And but did you enjoy the arts administration?
Like if that came up again, would you do that again or have you had your kick at that can? And it’s a no.
[Iain Moggach]
I I would. I there’s a lot that I liked. I mean, as I said, like the mission really drove a lot of it, like seeing the I mean, I don’t know if I could do it with any company.
I think I would need to really learn about that company or really align with that mission internally. But I think like. You know, as has been sort of clear, like Theatre by the Bay was my first job out of theatre school, you know, like and I and I put almost 10 years into it.
So I think and I there were certainly points throughout my experience there where I felt like, gosh, I wish I had more experience or like, gosh, I wish I knew this when I started and things like that. And I’m sure that’s always the case. But I think what what this what I’ve needed and what sort of life has given me now post theatre by the Bay is the chance to work with other companies and like see how they work and learn from the inside and that kind of thing and see like what I like that other companies do, what I don’t.
And all of that will feed and fuel me for when that next big arts management job, hopefully artistic director, because that’s more the side that I like, you know, that will that will I’ll be the more prepared in some ways for that when the time comes. And I think I’ll have a pretty unique edge because like I do. I’m you know, I’m 35 and I have a decade of high level arts management experience.
Like, you know, I raised one point five million dollars in grants before I turned 34. Like there’s not a lot of people. And in a company that was getting always see project grants when they were if they were lucky when I started.
So, yeah. And so, you know, I would when the time comes. But I think right now I’m honestly in the lane that I need to be.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Did arts administration teach you anything about what a director needs or what a director needs to do? Oh, that’s a good question.
[Iain Moggach]
I mean, yeah, for sure. I think certainly as a director now on the outside, a much more practical like, you know, I’ve just kind of like, you know, for instance, I with Bluebirds, I was able to kind of it didn’t take me very long to go, OK, this is how this company works and this is what my job is going to be and stuff. And fortunately, because of my sort of scrappy indie background, I was able to adapt pretty quickly to those kinds of environments.
But like, I don’t know, I feel I feel like a good director is someone who can who understands the core of a place so well that they can adapt it to the scope of the company that they’re working with, if that makes sense. Like if I did Bluebirds with with while I did theatre on the Ridge, but if I did Bluebirds at like Crows, you know what I mean? Like, I feel like my concept would be probably the same, but just like upscaled, if that makes sense.
But yeah, having a good producer background helps get you to those sort of conclusions in terms of what the company how the company works and what the the scope of the project will be much more much more quickly. And then also, like in terms of what I I think also like a director, at least a good director is a producer to a degree, like you do kind of think about, you know, messaging and audience and things like that. And I’ve, as I’ve been starting to kind of like pitch myself more to more companies, I have been actually thinking about that as a as a pretty strong value add where it’s like, if you hire me as a director, you’re not just getting a director, you’re someone who like has a Rolodex of of theatre reviewers that like him a lot and would come see his stuff.
You’re going with, you know, like I have lots of connections and things like that, that I’m not afraid to leverage. If you need me to go to a sponsor dinner and pitch my show with you because you need someone who’s excited, who can talk about the show, like I’m very familiar with that. If you need something for a grant application, I’ve written countless grant applications.
I can help with that. And people seem to have been seem to be responding to that as a value add as a director, your approach as a director, and especially we can use Bluebirds as an example.
[Phil Rickaby]
When you’re coming to a play like Bluebirds, where’s the first place you go? How do you take it from scripts to to casting to staging?
[Iain Moggach]
Honestly, I think my university background of text analysis really sets me on the right path. So I do. One thing I have is like I have a little bit of like a ritual about like the first time I read a script that I know I’m going to direct where I like have my, you know, my mug of tea.
I have my little notepad next to me and I have to like read the whole thing and just kind of like jot things down as they as just as they’re coming to me. And, you know, be it a little drawing, be it a word that stands out, a line that stands out. And I just because like the first time you read something, I don’t know if this is very obvious, but like whatever.
But for me, the first time you read something, knowing you’re going to direct it, you only get that once. So making sure that it’s given its proper due is is really important. And then, yeah, and then, you know, it’s a lot of reading and rereading and trying to read it from different perspectives and lenses, trying to meet with designers as early as possible.
And I like to think that I’m a director that’s extremely collaborative. I really value everyone’s opinions in the room. I really yeah, I really like meeting with designers as early as possible, often because sometimes they’re getting the script around the same time that you are.
Right. So like getting their first impulses as well can be really, really valuable and helpful. Yeah.
And then I try not to I try not to come to any conclusions about like, what is it trying to say until often quite late in the process? Like I have this there’s this exercise that Jeanette Lambermont-Morey, who directed me at George Brown, and I got to assist and direct for her while I was there, has where you kind of like really distill the script into, you know, one line of this is how it opens, like two to three lines. It’s like basic story crafting stuff, but really specific.
And then the climax of this of the play being a single line or a single stage direction, the anima thing. And I find that exercise really helpful when I feel that I’ve read it enough that I can come to those conclusions. And I also I don’t know, I also try to set myself a challenge with each show, like with Bluebirds.
One of the things that I knew I wanted to do was incorporate physical theatre into it. And I’m not like trained in physical theatre, really. But like when I was working with Alison McMacken, whom you should talk to if you haven’t, she’s amazing, did with us at George Brown was she did kind of like Grotowski inspired physical theatre work.
So I infused that because that was sort of the physical theatre vocabulary that I had into the Bluebirds process from the beginning and helped that sort of shape the choreography of it, because, well, especially with that, I’m going to narrow in on a point, I promise. But especially with that script, there’s like basically no stage directions. It’s all just tiny little vignettes.
So I felt and also it’s there’s this ethereal element and this practical element. So I thought having a strong physical theatre vocabulary beneath it would just add more momentum and sort of physicalize that ethereal quality. So anyway, so I set myself that challenge and the actors really responded to it.
And the audiences and the reviewers really responded to it as well. It just kind of worked in this beautiful way. But it wouldn’t have happened had I not sort of set myself that that challenge on on that show.
So, yeah, those are some of the things that I think about.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah. Working in Port Perry and working on this show. Is there anything that you learned during the process of working on Bluebirds?
[Iain Moggach]
Yes, so many things. But the one that stands out to me right now is that, boy, howdy, do I love directing when I don’t have to produce the show? You know, like because with Theatre by the Bay, I could feel my cell phone like burning when I’m in rehearsal.
Right. There’s emails, there’s messages, there’s things I got to take care of. Right.
And I just I had to just breathe, put that aside and just focus. Meanwhile, with Bluebirds, I had none of that. You know, I had none of that going on except some consulting work that I’ve been doing.
So just being able to go fully focused, it was like, oh, I’m really good at this, especially when I can just focus on what I need to focus on. So anyway, that may be a lifelong thing I work on. But that was one of the big takeaways was like, yeah, I I really love being able to just focus on the work when I can.
[Phil Rickaby]
I mean, it is it must be very difficult to be leading a company and leading a show because those are two very different responsibilities and different poles. So I can imagine I’m just like you were describing it. I’m imagining the burning of the phone.
Right.
[Iain Moggach]
Oh, yeah. And there were some really, really hard Theatre by the Bay stuff that was going on during some of those shows where it was like, oh, my God, we’re done rehearsal at six and I’ve got to raise four grand before I go to bed tonight. Otherwise, there’s no money.
Because like that check that we’ve been waiting on hasn’t arrived yet or like something’s delayed or postponed or whatever. And so just having that, you know, in the back of your head as you’re trying to focus on the beautiful work in front of you, it really requires an intense discipline. And I don’t miss it.
And then also, of course, like as you’re trying to I mean, I love text work. Right. As I said, like I love just spending as much time with the script as possible.
And when you’re raising the money or writing the grants or doing all the stuff that you have to do before you get into rehearsals so that you can set those rehearsals up for as much success as you can by not having to deal with as much stuff on the outside. Right. It’s just like you don’t get you literally just don’t have the time to be able to do that kind of intense text work that you love.
And Theatre by the Bay’s not it was not a big company ever, really. But, you know, it was myself as the full as the one full time staff member. Then I had a part time administrator and two contractors that had very specific jobs that they did in conjunction with a whole bunch of other jobs.
So it was me. Right. Like it wasn’t I didn’t have an assistant.
I didn’t have anyone else that well, apart from one through the Metcalf Foundation. Thank you, Metcalf Foundation. Bless the Metcalf Foundation.
But, you know, I didn’t have basically any help. So it was. Yeah.
If it was like, OK, we have to raise four grand by tomorrow. Guess who is the person who is doing it?
[Phil Rickaby]
That is too much for a person who is like also trying to do a show because you shouldn’t have to worry about that when you’re directing. So I can imagine it was very freeing to do this show and not have to ever worry about that at all. Absolutely.
Yes, for sure.
[Iain Moggach]
For sure. In fact, it was nice to be able to say to go to the producer and say how I carry the idea and be like, how can I help? What do you need?
Do you need me to go to this dinner? Whatever you need, I’m here for you and be able to support. It was nice to be able to do that.
[Phil Rickaby]
Well, you are like you said, you have the knowledge of the things that she’s dealing with. And I said something like abstract way. So you can offer that.
[Iain Moggach]
Oh, absolutely. And especially like because as we said, it’s a rural theatre. So like those actors are staying at these farms.
And guess who’s driving them to their farms after rehearsal? The artistic director of the company. So she had to add that into her day because none of these actors have cars because they’re all from Toronto.
Of course.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah.
[Iain Moggach]
Yeah. So I just I bless Carrie, bless Theatre on the Ridge. And yeah, it was so nice to be able to do as much as I could.
And I hope to be able to continue to help them and every company that I work with.
[Phil Rickaby]
Do you know what you have coming up next?
[Iain Moggach]
Yeah, so I have I have a production of The Seagull that I’m doing in the fall with Burrard Theatre, which I’m excited about. A couple other potential things. I’m also directing a community theatre show in the area, The Gravitational Pull of Bernice Trimble, which is a great Canadian play by Thomas Graham.
[Phil Rickaby]
I was just saying to somebody just the other day that we in this country, we do not have enough respect for community theatre in the UK. It’s part of the ecosystem and we sort of tend to get a little snooty about it here. And I think it is an essential part of our theatre world in Canada.
And we can’t ignore it and we shouldn’t ignore it.
[Iain Moggach]
Honestly, I love it. I love you know, if I can if I can do it, I try to because I mean, these are people that, you know, they’re not getting paid. They’re there to do it for the love of doing it.
It’s as as a director, it’s a chance to kind of flex a few muscles in terms of, you know, working with actors on those fundamentals. And often they’ll have a lot of habits and stuff that you get to work with them through and stuff. And then also, I mean, for someone that’s done a lot of indie theatre, sometimes they have bigger budgets on the set and design that special stuff that I’ve done.
And, you know, it obviously like it’s it. It’s complicated because, of course, artists deserve to be paid and things like that. Now, yeah, I wish that even they got something, but I do think that it is such an important part of the ecosystem.
And then also, yeah, like in terms of the shows that they do, I mean, when else would I do Gravitational Pull of Bernice Trimble? I mean, I did Dancing at Lunasa, like in 2019. And I did All My Sons in 2018 and stuff.
And they’re like, you know, amazing shows that the chances of doing them are so slim. And if they’re if those actors and designers are there to have a great time with you and you’ve got the time, I don’t know, I see nothing wrong with it. I think it’s really important.
[Phil Rickaby]
Yeah, I agree. Yeah, absolutely. Well, Ian, thank you so much for joining me.
I really appreciate it. And it’s been great talking to you.
[Iain Moggach]
Yeah, you as well. Thank you so much for for what you do and coming back and bringing this back. I think it’s it’s fantastic.
I’ve loved listening to the episodes that I’ve been able to. And yeah, kudos to you. And also, just very quickly, I’ve loved that you’ve been bringing in artists from outside of Toronto to talk about what they’re doing.
I think that’s just fantastic. Thank you so much.
[Phil Rickaby]
Thanks for listening. I’m going to tell you a little bit about next week’s show in just a second. But first, I want to make sure that I cover a little bit of housekeeping.
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patrons get early access to episodes, we participate in discussions about those episodes or about ideas that I might have for future episodes. And so if you want to be a part of if you want to help me to make this show both financially and to be a part of the people who help me make decisions about this show, become a patron, go to patreon.com/stageworthy, and sign up it just cost $7 Canadian a month. And for that little bit, you become part of the people who help make this show possible.
Next week, we’re going to be talking to Virgilia Griffith, who is currently at the Shaw Festival, starring in blues for an Alabama sky as well as part of the cast of that improvised show murder on the lake. You won’t want to miss this conversation. So I hope I will see you back here next week on stageworthy.
