#347 – Bronwyn Steinberg
Bronwyn Steinberg is a theatre director and community builder; she’s passionate about making theatre an inclusive gathering space where stories are shared that celebrate the diversity of human experience. Based in Calgary/Mohkinstsis in Treaty 7 territory, she is the Artistic Director of Lunchbox Theatre, and she recently directed The Importance of Being Earnest for Theatre Calgary. She loves working with the classics as well as new plays, and since coming to Lunchbox in 2020, she has directed both Home for the Holidays, a new musical by Cayley Wreggitt and Alixandra Cowman, and Rebecca Northan’s All I Want for Christmas. She has also directed 6 new play development workshops as part of the Lunchbox Stage One Festival of New Canadian Work and Stage Two, in addition to multiple workshops and premieres with other companies. She was based in Ottawa for 12 years, where she was the founding Artistic Director of the indie series TACTICS. Credits as an award-winning freelance director include The Drowning Girls and Bang Bang (Great Canadian Theatre Company), The Revolutionists and Miss Shakespeare (Three Sisters Theatre), Twelfth Night (A Company of Fools) and Raising Stanley / Life with Tulia—an accessible multimedia storytelling collaboration with Kim Kilpatrick and Karen Bailey. She has worked as an assistant director at the Stratford Festival, the Shaw Festival and GCTC and is a member of both the Lincoln Center Theater Directors Lab (2018 & 2019) and Directors Lab North (2020).
www.lunchboxtheatre.com
Instagram: @bronwynsteinberg
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Transcript
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Phil Rickaby
I’m Phil Rickaby, and I’ve been a writer and performer for almost 30 years, but I’ve realised that I don’t really know as much as I should about the theatre scene outside of my particular Toronto bubble. Now, I’m on a quest to learn as much as I can about the theatre scene across Canada. So join me as I talk with mainstream theatre creators, you may have heard of an indie artist you really should know, as we find out just what it takes to be Stageworthy.
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Bronwyn Steinberg is a theatre director and community builder and the artistic director of Calgary’s lunchbox theatre. She’s passionate about making theatre and inclusive gathering space where stories are shared that celebrate the diversity of human experience. In this conversation, we talked about the Calgary theatre scene how lunchbox Theatre has been a hub for new play development how Bronwyn found her way to lunchbox theatre and much more. Here’s our conversation
so Bronwyn, thank you so much for joining me, why don’t we get there because I’m, since I live in a bit of a Toronto Ontario bubble, not familiar with with some of the theatres outside of, of what I know and I have not heard of Lunch Box Theatre. So tell me about Lunch Box Theatre
Bronwyn Steinberg
Sure, was Lunch Box Theatre is kind of an institution out here in mo Kansas, also known as Calgary lunch box has been around for 47 years. And we do one act plays and we do them at lunchtime. So the idea from the Sounders was really to provide a different option for theatre for downtown office workers and shoppers, and whatever. And so the plays used to be pretty strictly like between 45 and 50 minutes, because people could like clock in and out of their offices and get there for lunch, which I think is really lovely and sweet, but totally not the way things work anymore. So we can now do, we could do a little bit over an hour if we need to, because we know that most people are probably not like punching a card when they go back to work. But we still do our plays at lunch. And it’s just people can eat their food in the theatre. And so we try to have a really sort of welcoming vibe. And one of the things I love about it is having that one act format, and during the day, it’s just accessible in a really different way than other kinds of professional theatre. There’s, whether it is people sitting in on a lunch break from work, or seniors, you know, who might have to go to the theatre with like, you know, a support worker or something like that, like different people can go to the theatre than maybe your typical crowd in the evening. And of course, we get the typical theatre going crowd as well. But it’s nice to be sort of a different offering in terms of accessibility. And, and again, yeah, our shows we try to make them really inclusive and welcoming. And that’s not only the environment and the format, but also the kinds of stories that we’d like to tell
Phil Rickaby
it’s fascinating that to me that that Lunch Box Theatre has this this long history in in Toronto, there was a company many, many, many years ago. Well, I said many years ago, maybe 1015 years ago, they tried doing something similar in the business district and it didn’t last very long. Hmm. And so it’s I think it’s wonderful to hear about a company that has found success doing that it for like the lunchtime crowd and things like that. What do you think is behind the success of the longevity of lunchbox theatre? Gosh,
Bronwyn Steinberg
such a good question. And I don’t know it’s it’s sort of hard to say because, like the the feeling of the kinds of audiences we’re reaching here in Calgary is not that different than what I could imagine. In Toronto, so I also don’t know why it hasn’t sustained itself there. You know, I think in the early years, especially because we used to be located really close to like, the sort of business centres and lots of office towers and things, that audience really became quite loyal. And I don’t know, I guess I found when I’ve heard, you know, people talk about, like, the art scene in Perth, Australia, or, you know, like places that are a little bit more away from the sort of cultural centres, I think that there’s an amazing thing where, where people really do come out for the arts, because they’re excited that it’s actually happening in their own community. And nowadays, Calgary’s got tonnes going on. So we really are a cultural centre here. But I think that those early days in the 70s, it was probably quite a special thing to have any kind of professional theatre as the different theatres here were popping up. And so I think it established lunchbox as just this kind of beloved tradition. And even though we’re in a different location now, so we have a little bit less proximity to like the office workers, it kind of doesn’t matter, because the work culture has changed so much anyway, in terms of people working from home, or like I was saying before, like the kinds of hours that people work, I feel like it doesn’t really make that big of a difference that we’re no longer in that previous location. But I think that was part of it. And also, there was a great deal with the city back in those days, I think the, for many years, that location, they lunchbox rented for something like $1, you know, and we now we don’t have that setup anymore. But I think that the sort of support that came from both local government and also the business sector, in the 70s, and 80s, really built quite an amazing and robust theatre scene here. And so lunchbox was part of that.
Phil Rickaby
I think it’s, I mean, I think one of the reasons why it that sort of lunchtime theatre didn’t succeed here is because it was too new. Nobody really done it before. And it takes time to build up an audience for that and didn’t have that kind of like, hey, you know, cheap rent or like subsidised rent, they had to pay like full retail rent in, in the debt, the main business area. So like, I it makes sense that they they didn’t have the opportunity to flourish. But I think it’s, it’s such a great idea to be able to bring theatre to people at that at that level, because I think sometimes evening Theatre has a barrier. I think so. Yeah.
Bronwyn Steinberg
Well, I’m especially in cities where the people don’t live as much in the sort of cultural district areas. And so if you get home from work and have to get that commute back to downtown or something, you know, it’s there’s a lot of weird little barriers, you don’t think of like that? Yeah,
Phil Rickaby
I think that we often don’t think about those. I mean, I’ve been very aware of over the last few years of how going to the theatre also means going out for dinner, finding parking, all these other things that you have to do, which at the end of a workday. Do you like you just thinking like, Is this really how I want to spend my evening, you know, and to bring it to people at lunch is a great little thing. Now you do? Mostly it might correct mostly like a new Canadian work.
Bronwyn Steinberg
Yeah, we don’t do exclusively new Canadian work, but it’s definitely an emphasis of our programming. And we have a successful developing new Canadian work that’s been around for 35 years. Now, the stage one festival, the new Canadian work, and that was created, I guess the founders kind of realised there wasn’t just many, one act plays to do as as lunchbox needed, because lunch box was busy and doing a lot of plays. So they realised Hey, we need to actually develop this work. And now it’s become such a great kind of breeding ground for new Canadian plays. And a lot of playwrights really get excited to sort of the, at the, at the one act form and giving that kind of structure a try before they want to write a full length play or whatever. And our venues have always been quite simple. So like, technical elements need to be that, you know, within reason, and we tend to do small cast shows this like right now we’re doing you know, about four actors is kind of our max and over overtime. I think I’ve seen photos from earlier seasons, that lunchbox or maybe they’d have like six actors, but generally a smaller more contained sign kind of structure, which I think a lot of playwrights benefit from practising and you know, sometimes the right sort of breeding ground for that is like a Fringe Festival or the or the fringe circuit, but sometimes you want something that’s kind of not, I don’t know, doesn’t have the same kind of fringe appeal, but could have a different appeal and I feel like those Yeah, lunch box has been a great place to develop all kinds of different stories.
Phil Rickaby
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I know what you’re saying about about friends, because I was just thinking, as you were describing that, that, that in many cases, the one act play doesn’t get a lot of respect not not in the professional worlds often in like some of the others. All these festivals are, they’re often student festivals or quote unquote, community and things like that. But a lot of times the one act outside of fringe doesn’t get a lot of respect and infringe. Because that’s pretty much all you can do in fringe. So it’s really fascinating to me, the the that, you know, that’s, and I think it’s great that that sort of like you’ve fostered that, because it is a great way for a playwright to, to learn to tell a story before expanding into a two act format.
Bronwyn Steinberg
Absolutely. And I mean, I just love I mean, it’s like, it’s short story writing versus novels, you know, in some ways, it’s harder, because you have to, you know, be more direct into the point to this, the story has to have its whole arc, but it has to do it in in less time. But of course, now, we love watching sort of TV that’s gotten that 55 minute length like that, you could tell a lot of story in under an hour. And I think, yeah, I think our audiences and I mean, ourselves, we’re quite drawn to that timeframe these days. And it’s funny, because I’m often trying to think like, How can I how can we lunchbox like, market the shows, according to the hits only an hour? Sound like, you know, I don’t know, I don’t want it to sound like we’re sort of degrading our work by saying that, but actually, when I’m scrolling through Netflix, and I see a show is an hour, I’m like sushi. Like, it’s actually a really great length for our attention spans. And again, like you can get a full story in it, but you have to write it really tightly. And I think that’s such a good exercise for playwrights.
Phil Rickaby
It’s an excellent exercise, like the the the ability to write a tight, one act play like you, you can only can only improve your writing. I was thinking about how you were saying, you know, it’s only an hour, which is like the kind of thing where you’re like telling an audience like, don’t worry, we’re only going to torment you for 50 minutes, and then you can go, you know, it’s like, kind of thing, but that’s, you know, it’s hard to sort of sell the short timeframe without sounding like that, because it’s the only point. But it’s really a selling point. But
Bronwyn Steinberg
how do you phrase it?
Phil Rickaby
Yeah. Well, that’s a good question. How do you phrase
Bronwyn Steinberg
it? No, no. I mean, we make sure it’s just like clear on our materials, what our runtime is. So people can see that? Well, especially our current show actually runs in our five. So our longtime lunchbox, patrons need to know it’s actually over an hour so they can plan for like parking and stuff. But most new patrons there that’s that to then it’s not really any difference if it’s 55 or 65 minutes. But yeah, to make sure the runtime is easy to find. But mostly, we try to focus on kind of the effect of, of, you know, what we hope people will walk away with our sort of tagline this season is lunch for your soul. Because a lot of our well all of our plays that we’re doing, I think, hopefully feel like a bit soul expanding. They’re really stories of human connection. I mean, it’s theatre. So that’s a lot of stories. But yeah, that that it’s, we also tried to not have our plays be too heavy lifting. Like in the middle of the day, you want to feel good when you want when you leave, going back to work or on about your errands, or whatever you want to be still talking about the story are still thinking about these characters, but like with a bit of a glow, you know, so So I definitely look for plays that leave you with a real sense of optimism. That doesn’t mean there can’t be any hefty, heavy lifting, but we need to like get there to a place of warmth and optimism.
Phil Rickaby
Yeah, you kind of especially in the middle of the day, you kind of do have to send them back to work feeling like they can continue their day. Exactly. Are there things that you look for in the 1x plays that lunchbox theatre does? Oh, yeah.
Bronwyn Steinberg
I mean, well, that thing I was just describing of that kind of sense of optimism and connection is really important to me. We do love comedies, musicals and love stories again, like it’s lunch, we want to have fun. Yes, it’s like an exploration of an identity kind of play. I don’t want it to be sort of like a trauma identity piece. I would like it to be a more joyful kind of thing. Again, a tight story well told, manageable number, a number of characters, setting requirements that allow us to really play In the small space that we have, like, I love scenic design that’s a bit more presenting kind of a fun visual metaphor rather than having to be fully realism, which I think also works well with the with the one act format format, often, I mean, sometimes you want it to just be kind of a kitchen sink, you know, very realistic kind of house setting. But I don’t know, I really, I feel like I’ve been drawn to plays that have a little bit more. Yeah, room for metaphor and playfulness, which is maybe more my own aesthetic than just lunchbox. But what something I keep coming back to is a feeling of elegance, right? And not like fancy elegance, but like simplicity and beauty in the storytelling. So again, a clear thrust to the story. Characters that do go on a journey and that we really understand and relate to, and in a place that’s that we can make sense of, you know, with with some. Yeah, some sense of like, as I keep saying the same thing, play playfulness, and metaphor, but like, in a way that doesn’t need a whole bunch of stuff to make it happen. I don’t need, you know, heavy piece.
Phil Rickaby
Right. Now, my experience with theatre in Calgary is, as I said, very quite limited. I was in in Calgary for the category of fringe about 12 years. It was a long time a number a number of years ago where the show and I didn’t really I mean fringe is so intense that you often don’t get a sense of what the theatre scene of the city that you’re in actually is like. Where does aside from nurturing playwrights and find and you know, sort of like being a starting point for a lot of playwrights? Where does lunchbox theatre sit in the Calgary theatre ecosystem? What does it bring? What is it? What is it nurture? What does it do? Aside from the playwrights aspect?
Bronwyn Steinberg
Yeah, well, it’s kind of that way for all artists, which is really special. When I first arrived here two years ago, it was, you know, we were deep in pandemic lockdown times. So we weren’t doing shows yet. So I had a little bit of time to get acclimated as I was kind of taking, taking the reins of lunchbox theatre. And so I put out a call to the community that if anybody just wanted to meet me on Zoom, they could. And I ended up having about 220 minute zoom meetings over the course of a few months. And that was one of the questions I was asking people because I wanted to know about their relationship to lunchbox, but also like about what they appreciated or loved about that relationship, because I want to make sure that we keep doing that if we’re doing something well. And I heard so many people from every discipline within theatre saying that lunchbox was where they’ve had their first professional gig, whether it was as an actor, stage manager, designer, director. And so it’s always been a place where emerging artists have really been supported, but a fully professional environment at the same time. So it’s not you know, it’s it’s, it’s not like people feel like they’re working with recent graduates and a couple mentor, teaching artists, it’s still if you’re an even if you’re an emerging artist, you’re in a fully professional show. And again, because it’s we’re, you know, a pack member, professional company, where it’s not the kind of vibe of rehearsing for a fringe show, which can be, of course, all over the map, it can be extremely professional, or it can be extremely ad hoc in your own basement or whatever. But yeah, so we have all the supports of being on an equity contract and all those things, but there just always has felt and this is what I kept hearing from people that they’ve always felt really, really welcome at lunch box and really supported. And that’s so awesome. To me, I just am so excited to be a part of that. And we’ve even kind of been expanding our support for emerging artists this year, we have a new programme that has even more emerging artists with us than usual, which is awesome. But it’s definitely been that place within the Calgary theatre ecology is a place where people do get a chance and also where people love coming back to work. And artists that are you know, that have been doing the work for decades. Love getting a chance to come back and do a show at lunchbox even if they haven’t been there for since they were in emerging artists or whatever. Especially if they have families like the shows are at noon, and they’re an hour so once you’re in run, like it’s a pretty sweet workday. And you can pick your kids up from school, you know, or whatever it is you need to do and you can be home with them in the evening or take them to another show or some of the artists who like have been working at lunchbox since the 70s. Were telling me that in in those days when the when the casting pool was smaller, they would be doing a show at lunch, Fox in the day and rehearsing a show at one of the other companies in the evening, which I think is kind of amazing. But now we’ve really like along with Patti, our general manager, she and I really agreed on kind of taking advantage of that, those aspects of the lunchbox model with the fact that you can sort of balance your life a little bit more. And so we’re like, and we only do one act plays. So we are doing the five hour, we’re a five day workweek, and we’re doing no 10 out of 12 We’re doing those things and trying to make even before we opened, try to make our workspace kind of more balanced and nurturing. Which is really cool. And I yeah, I’m really proud of that work. And also feel like if we can’t, is a one act company can’t be a leader in more humane work practices, than we’re all screwed. So like not only do I believe in it, but I also feel like obligated, closed in a good way. Because I think those are changes our industry needs. But yeah, if we can’t manage it, then then it’s true that we really need to rethink everything about what we do.
Phil Rickaby
And you think you and you know, the genuine question, do you think that you’re successfully navigating that?
Bronwyn Steinberg
I’m about to open a show tomorrow that we very successfully rehearsed in five day workweeks. And, you know, we checked this week, because, you know, we it’s a small show, so we did, or we did tech last week, and then into previews this week. So it wasn’t a super long process. We never stayed after six, except for one night when there was painting that needed to happen. But painting has to dry overnight. So we did the paint call, but We accommodated and then the day, then we knew that those people were going to be painting. And it’s I’m really proud of it. It’s a beautiful little show. It’s a one act musical. There’s 10 songs in it for actors and two musicians. A whole bunch of lighting cues. You know, it’s not like we didn’t do a full solid, beautiful show. We just did it in a manageable way, huh?
Phil Rickaby
Wow. Imagine, imagine if you mentioned you joined during the pandemic. And the pandemic was like a great interrupt for the whole theatre world. What was what was what was the impact of the pandemic on lunchbox theatre?
Bronwyn Steinberg
What was pretty huge. I mean, to be honest, pre pandemic lunchbox was not in the healthiest place, financially. And in terms of work practices, like we used to have our own venue and having your own venue kind of means you need to keep it full all the time. So we did a lot more shows. And we also had to kind of have our own relationship with renters using it when we weren’t using it. And the staff was bigger because of, you know, needing to have our own technicians and box office and you know, all those people. And it’s in some ways a shame that we don’t have that structure anymore. But the venue’s lease was out in September of 2020. And the board just decided to not renew it. And we are our old venue is in the base of the Calgary tower, and directly across the hall from vertigo theatre, who are our great friends, they do mysteries, which is awesome. And they have a much bigger facility. They have the full the vertical Playhouse, which I think is around 400 seats. And then they have a studio that’s 130 seats. And they spoke with our staff and with the board and said that they would allow us to be kind of primary renters of their studio space. And so we get kind of first dibs at the calendar once they know when they need it. And so now we’re producing across the hall so not a disruption, disruption really to our patrons, if any of them still don’t know we moved then all we have to do is say turn around. Look at the others at the door on the other side. So yeah, so our patrons have found their way and their facilities beautiful. And now we you know, we give their brilliant staff more hours, and we have a smaller staff. So because of the pandemic we’ve really completely refigured the way we work we’re doing four shows a season instead of eight or nine. We’re doing them in this rental venue, which is in some ways a better setup for us because they really good equipment, they have a little bit more seating capacity. We only had 100 seats before and now we’ve got 121 30 and we have this really lovely supportive relationship with vertigo. And that’s something I also really feel in the Calgary theatre ecology is really nice is that I feel like the different companies in town actually like each other and support each other in a really nice way, which is awesome. So yeah, so we’ve had some sort of major changes, and we now only have a full time staff of three. But then we have a bunch of part time contract folks, as well as our, you know, contractors on individual shows and things. So we still have quite a lot going on, but we’re trying to do fewer things and do them better. Which I think is not a bad shift in our industry in general.
Phil Rickaby
That’s not bad at all. Um, you mentioned the theatre companies in Calgary, sort of like, liking each other. And I have for years been operating with sort of like this, this, this idea, and it was actually inspired on the fringe circuit of fabulous fringe artist, Cameron Moore, my first time at the Montreal fringe had this seminar, the first thing that she said, was, there’s audience enough for everyone, if we’re not in competition, and I’ve really sort of held on to that I occasionally have mentioned that to people and I get pushback from them. Because they sort of it’s the idea of, you know, the idea that the audience, where is your audience going as the question that we’re always asking, and that we’re losing our audience, and so that makes people think that they’re in competition? And I really don’t think that that’s the case, generally, I think that, that that audience is the go to see good theatre, continue to see good theatre.
Bronwyn Steinberg
Absolutely. And like, you know, the more good theatre anyone is making, the more people will be interested in good theatre, because they’ll be you know, they see my show, and they’re like, Oh, that was cool. Then they hear about another show. And they might go to that, too. It’s not like, Oh, I already saw theatre, I’m done for the year. You know, I think instead, it’s totally the opposite. Like, Oh, I saw this play, and it made me feel things and I had a good time. And I laughed, and, you know, I kinda want to do worry about Yeah, I mean, Calgary is neat, because the the for like, bigger companies are all really different in what we do. So we really, really aren’t in competition. Like I said, our our closest colleagues are the ones that we share space with vertigo. They do mysteries, and they do like big mainstage productions. Right now. They’re doing Murder on the Orient Express this huge, like, 12 person cast, there’s a train on stage. It’s beautiful. It’s like such a different experience than our warm holiday. Christmas musical, you know, that we’re doing, which is so charming. I don’t even like Christmas, and it’s so charming. But yeah, it’s such a different feeling that like, yes, they’ll appeal to very different people, the people who love theatre will come to both, but also there’s room to then for the people who don’t already come to theatre for the ones who are like, Oh, I love murder mysteries. I love Agatha Christie, they’ll go see the vertigo show, and that’s awesome. I don’t need them to necessarily come to see my Christmas musical. But then there’s gonna be people who are like, Oh, Christmas musical, that’s a fun and they’ll come to mine. And maybe then I’ll go to a murder mystery. That’s okay, too. You know, and then the other bigger companies theatre, Calgary and Alberta theatre projects. I mean, theatre, Calgary is like a big a house mainstage place where they do big scale musicals, and they do classics, or they do newer Canadian works that are partnering with, you know, can Stage Arts Club or whatever. So like, that’s a really particular different kind of theatre going experience, where people are like, Yeah, I want to go in the fancy lobby and be there at night and all that stuff and have the kind of like, big theatre experience. And then Alberta theatre projects, has also a great tradition of developing new Canadian plays, that ones that are maybe a little bit edgier than we do at lunch box, and certainly aren’t one hour and things like like, there’s room for all of us.
Phil Rickaby
Hmm, it’s funny. You mentioned you know, somebody seeing their play for the year and I feel like some people do that, because I think they get the idea that theatre is expensive, maybe they saw a Broadway show, and they pay it out of the a paid out of the wazoo for those tickets, or they were in Toronto, and they saw a big Mirvish show in there, I can only afford to do that, like once a year, but there’s so many companies that are more affordable in the way that like, you know, if you take the family to see a movie now and then you can get the same, you know, you can see a show and, you know, we it’s available but sometimes I think the theatre doesn’t do a great job of of sort of like up talking itself like selling itself as as as as a form of entertainment. That is, you know, you could do that in the evening. You Yes, you can see the movie, but you can also see something really cool over here. Yeah,
Bronwyn Steinberg
totally. I and that’s something I feel like we we could do better in collaboration as a theatre community. I don’t know how I don’t have like the answer for that. But I think yeah, I think you’re right that as a kind of sector, we could, we could do better chalking that up. I mean, it’s funny though, here in Calgary, your parking is going to cost more than your theatre ticket. Which is, which is a problem. Actually, that is
Phil Rickaby
a problem. That is that is a real problem. Yeah.
Bronwyn Steinberg
But like, you know, we we are, that’s another thing that we just we want to be accessible. So our tickets are lower. Also, like our shows are smaller and shorter. So like, it does feel that you can’t ask people to pay like $18 for alcohol. That’s just only 55 minutes long, you know? Yeah.
Phil Rickaby
Now, you mentioned recently joining lunchbox theatre. Where were you before? And what? What brought you too young to lunchbox?
Bronwyn Steinberg
Yeah, so I mean, this job brought me here. I was actually born in southern Alberta closer to Lethbridge. And my mom’s a professor at the University of Calgary. So Alberta has always been kind of one of my homes. But I hadn’t actually lived here for more than maybe, you know, two months in the summer, until I took this job. But when I saw the job was up, it was like, Oh, what a what an exciting opportunity. I’ve kind of had my eyes on Calgary for a while because I had been here enough to really get a sense of how exciting the theatre community here was, and also had family connection. But I actually came here from Ottawa, where I was for about 12 years. I went there to do my master’s in directing my MSA at Ottawa, EU. And you know, you go somewhere to do a two year programme, and then you find yourself there 12 years later, because you started doing all kinds of things. So yeah, I was in Ottawa for that amount of time. And while I was there, I created an indie theatre series, called tactics, which is a project I’m really proud of, and is still operating in Ottawa, which is great. When I came to lunchbox, I had a few other artists sort of take the lead. And now we’re actually we incorporated as a not for profit, about a year before I left. And so I’m actually now on the board, which is fun that I can still support from away, but also see it grow and change under new artistic leadership was really fun. But tactics is does a lot of things that are kind of similar to lunch box, which is I guess, what felt like such a natural kind of progression for me, in terms of it is a place where independent artists and emerging artists can kind of grow into their professional practice. But it’s really a home for the kinds of shows that maybe don’t fit at the fringe, because maybe they’re too ads, or maybe they have a complicated set design or whatever. So it’s kind of a subscription series, or not always actually the subscriber model, but a kind of a series of indie shows that happen in the same venue and have a bit of support. And they’re curated. But they’re still the shows generally still have a full sort of production run run. It’s not unlike kind of the riser project and kind of some of those things that have been happening in Toronto. It’s a not not exactly the same model. And we happen kind of in parallel. So it’s been neat to see how it’s happening in other places. Saskatoon has something called the live five, which I was also really inspired by when I heard about it. But yeah, it’s a place where indie artists can get some of the similar kind of support you would have at the fringe, but to be able to do a mainstage show. And then in addition, in addition to mainstage programming, there’s also development, programming, and community building kind of programming. We have the Development Series, the mainstage series, and then the community building, we call it the greenroom series. And so different events, like things like a grant writing workshop or something, but also like an office holiday party for artists who don’t work in offices, or things like that.
Phil Rickaby
That’s awesome. That’s awesome.
Bronwyn Steinberg
That was a long answer.
Phil Rickaby
I love it. I love it. Speaking of where you’ve been. One of the things that I really love to hear about are, are people’s theatre origin stories, the thing that that that made you or the journey that brought you from, like, Well, how did you discover theatre? How did you decide that it was going to be a thing you do? You did? And what’s what what was that journey? Like?
Bronwyn Steinberg
Yeah, well, it’s kind of funny. My mom I mentioned my mom is a professor at the University of Calgary. She’s a professor of education and before she was a prof when she was still a teacher in schools. She was a drama teacher. So basically, from when I was about six on she took me to rehearsals with her so I kind of just grew up thinking when you grew up, you were like, yeah, when you grew up, you’d become a theatre director, because that’s what grownups do. They direct plays. So it was that’s kind of where I started. But along the way I focused more on acting in for undergrad and for a few years after I graduated, and I don’t know, if I was just, it’s hard to know if I was like, in the wrong place at the wrong time. Or maybe I’m not actually a very good actor. Or if I wasn’t patient enough or what, but I didn’t feel like I don’t know, I was getting a lot of great work in T ya, which is really fun. But I didn’t know sort of where to go next as an actor, and I was living in the US at the time. So I’m a dual citizen. And then I was invited to be an assistant director for that TYT, a company I worked for. And that was really cool. And I was like, oh, maybe I’m really interested in directing. And then that went well. So they invited me back to direct and I directed a two person version of A Christmas Carol, that went to toward two elementary schools and middle schools all over the US. And the way they worked is they was because it was a two person show, they would have multiple two person teams that would all be touring the show in different regions. So that season, I directed nine to person teams, and wow, it was so much fun, we would have a separate rehearsal for each team. So we’d have, we basically were on a three day cycle. And they were doing two shows. So they would have like day one, they’d have a three hour rehearsal with me, on day two, they’d have a three hour rehearsal on their other show. And then day three, they’d have the day off. And then meanwhile, I would do the same rehearsal nine times in a row. But I would do it, you know, team, ABC on day one, def, or whatever, on day two, and so on. And I found through doing the same show with nine different pairs of actors that it was really neat to be able to dig into the same story, and try to have basically similar blocking and the same set and costume design and everything and same same show, but really honour the actors, different energies and the way each team of actors work together. And I just, maybe also because my background is an actor, I just really admire and respect that how actors collaborate with a director and I found that I just loved it. And I was like, Okay, well, maybe more. I’m more of a director than an actor. So I went to grad school and fell years went by and here I am. Yeah, but my really istorage and is like, actually, I went to rehearsal when I was six with my mom. Hmm.
Phil Rickaby
Interesting. Do you do you have a memory of the first thing that you recall being rehearsed?
Bronwyn Steinberg
Like, as a little kid? Yeah. Oh, yeah. She was doing Greece at a high school. And, actually, I don’t know if you know, carry match. It was in that cast. And she’s, you’ll recognise her on lots of different TV things. But she was in that high school. And she and my mom are actually still friends. And I’m friends with her now, too. But I remember going to rehearsal and I remember, I don’t know, I guess, the image I have of Greece. In my head. It’s hard to know what’s like funny photos I’ve seen in the family and what’s actually a memory. But I think I really remember the song Freddy, my love being rehearsed. And I think I remember that, because it’s not in the movie, is it?
Phil Rickaby
It’s one of those songs in the movie. That’s actually and I’m such a nerd for knowing this. It’s played in the background over the right,
Bronwyn Steinberg
but they don’t do the whole thing. Oh, they don’t do the whole thing. Yeah. And I have this image of seeing, seeing these high school girls doing the whole thing. So I think that’s, I think that image comes from rehearsal.
Phil Rickaby
Nice. That’s awesome. But that
Bronwyn Steinberg
was always a song that I was like, Yeah, I love that song. And then it’s like watching a movie. I’m like, Hey, where is that?
Phil Rickaby
There are a bunch of songs that are great songs that are not in the movie. But if you bought the movie soundtrack, they’re on there. Okay, good to know. I don’t know they recorded them. So they kept them at a rate that we were able to do a double album because of those. Oh, wow. So the more expensively, I’m just coming back to lunchbox theatre. I know that. And one of the things I’ve talked with a few people about, about mentorship and mentorship, as far as like the, the future of leadership in in the theatre. There were a number of years that I remember living through where a theatre company in Canada would be looking for a new leader. And they would find one but never in Canada, they would bring somebody from the state, they would bring somebody from England, things like that. And I’m seeing we’re seeing more and more now, the companies who have a Canadian leaders, but I think it’s also important that that all of those companies, the companies are nurturing the next generation of leadership. So we don’t have We’re have to look outside our own country to find a leader for a company. And I know that lunchbox has an associate artists company, or is that is that actors? Is that is that leadership? Or is it the whole gamut? Ah, well,
Bronwyn Steinberg
it’s so this is our new sort of pilot programme. That is that I mentioned briefly before, I’m really excited about it. So this one is all geared for not onstage artists. So we there’s actually no actors in it, though some of them are also actors in addition to what they’re doing. But we have a director, a playwright, dramaturg, one of our assistant stage managers is part of the programme to designers, and an a production manager. And so each of them directly mentors with one of the three core staff. So as Artistic Director, my three are the director, the playwright in the dramaturg, the two designers in the production manager are working with Anton, our production manager. And the ASM is working with Patty, our general manager who was a stage manager for many years before she shifted into administration. So what they’re doing is they’re with us for the whole season. And we meet with the whole cohort once a month, so that they can really understand how the overall company is working. And then they also work on the shows as they come along. So my, my assistant director was in rehearsal with me for the show we’re about to open. And they’re not necessarily with us full time, like the the kind of that kind of structure of an assistant director, but more like getting to shadow but also getting to, like, ask questions and contribute ideas, certainly. And then the assistant director, or assistant designers doing a similar thing, working with our designers. So they get to really see the whole process in action, but they get to see it on four shows over the course of the season, and then also get to be let in on overall how this how the company works, which I think is it’s not necessarily directly kind of leadership residency. But I think that knowing how the whole thing works, and know will lead to artists who understand better, how were their places, and the ones that want to explore more leadership will actually have a chance to know what that even mean. But I think if you just get brought in as like an assistant designer on one show, it’s neat, and you get to learn from that designer on that show. But how do you like what, how do you learn what’s next, you know, and I’m firmly believe, even though so many artistic directors and artistic leaders do come from sort of the directing discipline, there’s no requirement that we need to be directors, you know, like leadership can come from anywhere. And so I think having that whole cohort, get to kind of see and get to know the team, the leadership team at lunchbox through the season, I’ll be interested to see which of them do as they grow into themselves as artists, like figured out that leadership is a as a larger concept is something they’re interested in. Last year, we got to apply for or we got we were successful in applying for a particular leadership residency grant that’s available here in Alberta, from this foundation called the Rosae foundation, it’s kind of similar in Ontario to the Mac cast foundation grants. I don’t know if you know those. But because of that, we were able to have an emerging artistic leader be kind of my mentee for the whole season. And that was more of an artistic leadership training. And that was awesome. And I hope we get to do it again. I know there, I talked to the person over in charge over there and ask them like, can we apply right away? And he was like, well, we kind of want to spend that and spread that money around and make sure it’s really about the relationship between the mentee and the organisation too. So it’s not really on me to be like, this is something we always do and people just apply for the thing. It’s more like when I in conversation with an emerging artists or an emerging artist, artistic leader, as they see it, like spending time at lunch box would really benefit them, then I know it was at lunch box. And so then we can apply for that grant. And I’m hoping that maybe we can do that like every other year or something. But it’s still a new programme. So I’m not sure you know how long they’ll be funding it and all that stuff. But it’s so important. I had the chance in Ontario to do one of those Metcalf grant internships. And I did that with Eric Coates at GCTC in Ottawa for a year. And it’s a huge part of my learning to and that has brought me to this role now like I constantly am thinking sort of what would Eric do, as I do my work here? And I’m just Yeah, so, so valuable. And I don’t know, I don’t know how you learn it without getting to actually work with a mentor and witness it.
Phil Rickaby
Yeah. Yeah. You mentioned I mean, bringing all of these Is the Euro cohort together and, and have them with you for so long and learning about how everything works. They’re not just learning. And I think what what is what is great about that, I think is not just that they’re not just learning one job, but they’re learning how all of the jobs relate to each other, which is so important. It’s all well and good to learn how to be a designer. But you also need to know how the designer talks to the director and how the designer talks to the stage manager and, and how all of those relationships can work. Otherwise, you will only know one aspect of the job and you’ll learn the rest of the hard way. Well, for sure.
Bronwyn Steinberg
And I think that that benefits everyone, no matter which discipline you’re in. But also, as I said, like to become an artistic leader, you kind of need to know what everybody’s doing.
Phil Rickaby
Yeah, absolutely. Now, tell me about the old dogs new tricks project.
Bronwyn Steinberg
Oh, this is so neat. So this is headed up by Natasha from Theatre in New Brunswick, and a whole bunch of other cool artists from across Canada. And like a working group that came together, I think, mostly out of Pat’s Environmental Stewardship Committee. It’s kind of what, that’s where this project kind of emerged. But it’s an a project exploring sustainable design. And they got a grant from the Canada Council, one of those sector innovation development grants. And so I think it’s 10 companies from across Canada are participating this year. And we’ve been kind of tasked with trying out more sustainable practices on one of our shows. And they kind of have left it to us understanding that each company is in a really different situation in so many different ways, whether that’s the size of our venue, or you know, what, like geographically where we are the kind of show we’re working on. So they haven’t told us you need to make a carbon neutral show, or you need to do a bi nothing new show, or you know, they haven’t told us that. But what they did do is at the beginning of the project, they set up for webinars to be as kind of a inspiration point for us to learn and take that into our work. And then there’s also we have access to some mentorship with them. And and then yeah, we each company kind of creates their own set of parameters and a bit of a creative agreement of how they want to do this. And it’s been really cool to really, those webinars are just really great resources. And I think there’s recordings available. So maybe I can send you them and you can put put the link in the show notes or something. But the Yeah, to think about our practice, and you know, whether it’s a question of like, oh, this play is just contemporary modern dress, so we could very easily just shop for all the costumes in the mall. But fast fashion has these kinds of environmental impacts. And even if the clothes are cheap, does that actually is that actually a good choice? Maybe instead, we shouldn’t be going to thrift stores. But if we go to thrift stores for these clothes, maybe we’re gonna have to drive all over Calgary. And that’s going to be a lot more carbon with the drive. And so it’s just been really interesting. It’s not like there’s one way to make your design more sustainable. But it’s been really great to learn all about. Oh, very curious. That’s Hey, Michelle. It’s okay. So someone’s making noise out there. Oh, oh, my goodness. He’s so loud. It’s okay, then. Yeah. So there’s not one way to make your show or your theatre company more sustainable. And let’s be honest, I know that if the entire theatre Kadian theatre sector became green, quote, unquote, whatever that is tomorrow, we’re not going to stop the climate crisis. Yes. Yeah. I understand that. Bonds. We are storytellers. And so if we can actually tell the story of the things we’re doing differently and reach audiences, whether it’s in the play, it’s part of the story, or whether it’s a note in the programme about how we did the play, or whether it’s something that’s on our social media, like, that’s what we are is we’re storytellers can we help? Again, I don’t know that we can stop the climate crisis. But can we help me by harnessing our power, as storytellers and so that’s the thing that I’m really excited about this project. And then my understanding is all 10 companies will share what they did and and so other companies can learn and be like, Oh, actually, like, some things are just a system swap. Like sometimes it’s just yeah, you know, just use this kind of lighting instrument instead of that lighting is right, you know, like, there are things you can do. But, you know, and then other things, it’s like, you know, my designer For this show that we opened tomorrow, she attended those webinars. And we all did. That was a neat thing too about this project is they wanted the artistic leadership of the company, and the show director and the designers and production managers all to be attending it so that we could all kind of get on board with the conversation, and not just be like, Oh, Kay designer, can you just do this better? Like, no, we all need to know how we’re how we’re trying to make it better. But yeah, those, those conversations really inspired her and she came up with this design that is beautiful and elegant, use, it doesn’t use a lot of material. And then when she was figuring out exactly how to scale it and build it with our production manager, they were like, Oh, well, there’s no need to make it that size, when we could just make it an inch bigger or smaller, or whatever. And then the lumber is way more reusable afterwards, you know, and if we do the joints in this way, it’s very easy to pull it apart and actually use it rather than it going in the dumpster. Right? So it’s just planning how to build it better. And again, sometimes it’s figuring out that thrift stores are good. Sometimes it’s figuring out that the mall is good, but it’s just actually asking the question. And mainly, I think the number one thing to make things more sustainable in terms of design, and in terms of what we actually our practices, is actually just giving the time to the question. We are so pressed for time always in Canadian theatre, and it’s a bit crazy. And we don’t like there’s always the like, well, I’ve got this problem, I can solve it with more money, or more people or more hours, you know, can we start earlier, and then we don’t have to necessarily for throw more people or money on it at it. We could just give it some more hours, and then we can do it better. Yeah. It’s easier said than done. I know. But yeah, it’s a really cool project. We’re excited to be part of it. And I don’t know exactly yet, how it all went on this first show. Like, I know that we did those things, and that the designers were really on board with that. And we did a lot of its people in an airport. So we needed a bunch of different backpacks and things. So we actually crowd sourced all those from the team and just found the ones that felt like the closest to the character. And then, but we like those things are being rented from each person who loaned them and they’re on insurance and all that stuff. So we’re like doing it with care, not just hey, can we use your neck, trying to do it, like with some formality and with some care, but we don’t need to buy a new backpack for someone to like, sling it around, you know, for two seconds at the beginning of a play, right?
Phil Rickaby
Yeah, yeah. It’s, I mean, you sort of talked about the the way that, you know, we’re always the theatre is always it’s a treadmill of production, right? It’s always going, it’s always going, which has often. I don’t know if it’s, sometimes it’s prevented us from having those conversations. But sometimes that treadmill has acted as a bit of an excuse for not having important conversations, whether it’s diversity, whether it’s sustainability, it’s just, we’re just doing this thing, and we got to get through it. And it’s important to have and to take the time to have all of those conversations. So I’m I’m glad that this is something that’s that’s happening with lunch box with other companies as well to to have the sustainability conversation and to put effort and time into it. Yeah,
Bronwyn Steinberg
yeah, I know. It’s, it’s, that’s exactly it. It’s such a treadmill. But we’ve just we stopped that treadmill for the last couple years, and we’re starting it back up. And unfortunately, most people seem to be starting it back up, but a higher setting than it was before. Yeah. And it’s like, Did we learn anything here? Man, I don’t know. I mean, I hope that we did. And I know we at lunchbox are trying to really implement the things we’ve learned. And, you know, there’s, we’re not, we’re not perfect by any means.
Phil Rickaby
But we’re trying. I think that I mean, I think that, you know, starting up the treadmill, again, is you know, it didn’t doesn’t have to be that way, we had time to pause and think we had lots of important conversations. And then to start things up again, and to ignore all the conversations that we had, and all of the time that we took, and all of the thinking that we did is super short sighted. Yeah, I do know that and one of things that I wanted to talk to you about, because it feels to me like a kind of a result of the policy and, and really a smart way to work is that you it’s important to you to build an environment that’s nurturing and playful. And productivity comes later, like at the same time but you need the other two as as a base before you can really have good productivity. Is that a new thing for you? Or is that how you’ve always operated?
Bronwyn Steinberg
I think it’s become more conscious now. I think it is generally how I tried to operate before I don’t know if I was always that successful, especially like if it was a more high pressured environment or a harder project that might have not done as good a job as I hoped I would. But having had this time to reflect and also being the person and artist Sick leadership like, you know, rather than being sort of a gigging director all the time, though, I still happy to do that if anyone wants to hire me. But like, because I have that sort of relationship to the company, as well, it’s really important to me to create to not only create an environment like that in my own rehearsal hall, but for the overall company, and to see that relationship. And I just think, the productivity, it’s not that it comes later, it actually comes better. If you do it this way. I think there needs to be people need to feel supported, their needs need to be met, and they need to feel actually, like they really can express those needs, and everybody’s needs are different. And if their needs are met, and there is room for play and collaboration and fun, then the productivity will happen. It doesn’t you don’t have to always start exactly at 10. Right on, you know, like sometimes. I mean, people have been doing check ins for years, but like, doing it in a way where it’s really, really listened to the people. Make sure they actually have what they need not doing it because you feel like oh, yeah, people are doing check ins these days.
Phil Rickaby
Well Bronwyn, thank you so much for taking the time to talk to me tonight. It’s been a pleasure to get to know you and to learn about lunchbox theatre.
Bronwyn Steinberg
Oh, thank you so much, Phil, for having me. I’m just yeah, I’m very proud of the things we’re doing. So it’s nice to be able to tell the story of it. And I know Yeah, it’s nice. I appreciate this podcast to help connect artists from across our our land here across Turtle Island, finding out what everybody’s up to.
Phil Rickaby
This has been an episode of Stageworthy Stageworthy is produced, hosted and edited by Phil Rick. That’s me. If you enjoyed this podcast and you listen on Apple podcasts or Spotify, you can leave a five star rating. And if you’re listening on Apple podcasts, you can also leave a review those reviews and ratings helps new people find the show. If you want to keep up with what’s going on with Stageworthy and my other projects, you can subscribe to my newsletter by going to Philrickaby.com/subscribe. And remember, if you want to leave a tip, you’ll find a link to the virtual tip jar in the show notes or on the website. You can find Stageworthy on Twitter and Instagram at Stageworthy pod and you can find the website but the complete archive of all episodes@stageworthy.ca If you want to find me, you can find me on Twitter and Instagram @PhilRickaby and as I mentioned, my website is Philrickaby.com. See you next week for another episode of Stageworthy
