Jennifer Walls

Jennifer Walls is a performer producer, and voice-over actor. As a musical theatre performer she has played leading roles in a wide variety of musicals including RENT, Beauty And The Beast, The Wizard of Oz and number of Canadian premiers as well as the Dora Award nominated original musical review Off-Broadway, On Stage. She was also a finalist in the CBC hit show How Do You Solve A Problem Like Maria?

As a voice actor she has voiced recurring characters on a number of animated series’ including PBS’ Peg+ Cat and Amazon’s Creative Galaxy and I am currently the voice of Family Jr.

Jennifer is also the director of Hart House Theatre’s production of Heathers: The Musical.

www.jenniferwalls.com
Twitter: @jeni_walls
Instagram: jeniwallsto

www.harthouse.ca
Twitter: @HHTheatre
Instagram: hhtheatre
Tickets: https://tickets.harthouse.ca/

Transcript

Welcome to episode 148 of Stageworthy. I’m your host, Phil Rickaby. Stageworthy is a podcast about people in Canadian theatre featuring conversations with actors, directors, playwrights, and more.

The astute among you may have noticed that there was no episode last week, and if you were looking for one, I’m sorry for that. I was super tired. I just got back from the Halifax Fringe, and I just didn’t have anything in the tank, so there was no episode last week.

So I’d like to apologize for that. If you were looking forward to an episode or maybe an update about Fringe, all of that stuff, if you really want to know how Fringe was, take a look at the Fringe roundups that I recorded in St. John for the Fundy Fringe and the two in Halifax. That’ll give you sort of a sense about how things were.

Guys, the Fringe season is over. That’s it. It just ended.

Three Fringe festivals ended. The last three that end the Fringe season ended, and if you participated in a Fringe, congratulations. You finished the season.

If you toured with a Fringe show, oh my god, you’re amazing. Doing a show at Fringe is so challenging and hard at times, but rewarding. So if you took a Fringe on tour, you went to a place you’re not from, and you did a show, you are amazing, and you should be proud of yourself for everything that you accomplished, regardless of reviews or audience or anything else.

You did the thing, so amazing for you. I did the thing, and it had its good moments. It had its bad moments.

I had moments of exhilaration. I had moments where I broke down and cried, and that, I think, is just taking a Fringe show on tour. There are always going to be challenges, and sometimes you have to let it out, and I did.

If you guys enjoy the show, if you like stage really, if you could tell a friend about it, if you think they would enjoy it, that would be amazing. I have always loved when somebody suggests a podcast to me, and when I like that podcast, when I love that podcast, I’m actually more loyal to that podcast because somebody suggested that I listen to it. So if you enjoy this podcast, and you know somebody that you think would love it, tell them about it.

And if you want to tell me about the person that you introduced to the show, or if somebody introduced you to the show, and you want to tell me about it, or you just want to tell me what you think about the show, I would love to hear from you. You can find Stage Really on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram at stageworthypod. You can find the website at stageworthypodcast.com. And you know what? If you want to drop me a line, you can find me on Twitter and Instagram at philrickabee, and my website is philrickabee.com. My guest this week is Jennifer Walls, and Jennifer is a Toronto-based performer, producer, voice actor, and now the director of the Hart House production of Heather’s The Musical.

And I don’t know about you, but I have been basically obsessed with Heather’s as a musical ever since I heard that it was a thing. I have not had the chance to see it. I’ve only had the chance, as many of us have, to listen to the amazing soundtrack from the Off-Broadway production.

I’m looking forward to seeing this because this musical is pretty amazing. The music is great, and I know Jennifer is putting a whole lot into it. And from everything that I’ve seen on Instagram, and even from the things that she’s talked about in our conversation, I know that it’s going to be an amazing show.

So if you haven’t got your tickets, get your tickets for the Hart House production of Heather’s, and here’s my conversation with Jennifer Walls. But you’re going from, like, this is the first thing, Heather’s is the first thing that you’ve directed. Yeah, just a little 20-person controversial dark comedy.

Sure, yeah. I mean, first off, how did that happen, and how do you feel about it? Well, okay, so it’s a very, it’s a long story, and so I’ll try and make it as concise as possible. Like, so I, so Hart House is the first, well, okay, let’s go to the, so how did it start? In the winter, okay, go back to last year.

This is really inarticulate. This is a great start. So last year, I was really, like, sick in the spring, and we didn’t know what it was, and we were looking at several different things that it could be, and the different, like, side effects, and symptoms, and outcomes, and what it could be.

And one of them was that I could potentially lose my voice if it was this one particular thing that was happening. And so I was like, okay, so how does someone whose voice is their entire career, how do I, what do I do to support myself, and also to, like, continue to fulfill myself creatively? Because literally, like, all my work is, like, singing, and acting, and voiceover work, and singing, like, being a singing teacher, and all this stuff. So I was like, well, directing maybe is a way that I could, like, still communicate, and still be within that community.

And that’s not to say, oh, I could just be a director. Like, it’s, it’s, that’s, I didn’t know that I could do it, but I was like, this is something I could look into to maybe, you know. So it turns out it wasn’t the worst case scenario, and it was, it was fine.

I’m not gonna lose my voice, although I’ve had my share of vocal problems over the past year, which has been a whole other thing. But so in the winter, I started to seriously consider this. And Heather’s was a musical that, in doing the open mic that I did, I would hear a lot of songs from Heather’s, and it’s a great score.

And I was like, I have this idea. And I say a lot of things, like, I talk a lot. And I was like, how much of it do I actually follow through? Yeah, yeah, a decent amount, but not all of it.

So I was like, I’m gonna do this one day. So I just kind of threw it into the universe. And then I approached Hard House.

And I was like, so what do you think about this idea? Because Hard House is the first theatre I ever worked at in Toronto. So when I moved here after theatre school, I went to Sheridan College, and I moved here. And then someone sent me an audition notice for Reefer Madness, which is also a Kevin Murphy piece, and he wrote Heather’s, which is a crazy full circle.

So someone was like, Oh, this sounds like something you could do, you should do it. I almost didn’t go to the audition, which is funny. And then I did.

And so I did Reefer Madness at Hard House. And then I went back and I did High Fidelity as well, a few years later. So, you know, and I’d stayed in touch with the team and kind of was familiar with the infrastructure and how it kind of worked in it.

I love that it’s an environment that’s meant to learn. Everybody there, it’s kind of the understanding, we’re all there to learn together. And it’s not, it’s not about like, I mean, it’s always about perfection.

We always want to be the best we can, obviously. But this is more about learning and giving opportunity to emerging artists and, and working together and learning and honing in on your craft. So I was like, Okay, what do you think about this idea? And the rights weren’t available at the time.

But he was like, here’s our come in for a meeting. And here’s there’s like a questionnaire you fill out if you are proposing, or a potential director at Hard House. And I was going through this questionnaire.

And it was in the winter, the winter was rough. I think it was a rough winter for a lot of people this year, just because it was so just like gray and disgusting for months on end. And it was really nice to have something to focus on in the winter being like, I feel crappy, but there’s this.

So I was going through this questionnaire and realize I have answers for these questions. Like I haven’t written an essay in years. So it had been a while.

And I was like, getting really excited about it. I was like, this is, this is cool. This is great.

And because I’m familiar with the way that that sort of infrastructure theatre works. And I’ve done different like friend shows and self produced work and equity work also, and a mix of like, professional and non professional stuff. So I felt like I had a good scope of, of how it worked.

And, and it’s a great show. It’s a great message. It’s a great show for Hard House, because it’s a high school set in a high school.

And so it’s a lot of young people, which is great. And then, yeah, went in had the meeting, turns out we got the rights and they would like to have me on and it just all kind of it just kind of all came together. It’s it was good timing.

It was just the right time, I guess things aligned. And I had put it out in the universe a while ago and just kind of kept on it and followed through, which is not something I do all the time. I talk a big game, do I follow up? Not all the time.

So yeah, I feel like it was just something that was kind of that’s kind of meant to happen right now. And it’s it’s been a really good exercise for me working with these young people. And like I teach singing as a, as a job as well.

So like, and I’ve produced and kind of directed a little bit here and there and self produced. So I’ve worked with teams before, but it’s been really like, it’s been really cool getting to work with them as you know, and I’m like, well, maybe I’m not ready for this. I was like, that was Reef of Madness was 12 years ago.

I’ve done, I’ve done a lot of different stuff in that time and learned a lot. And I, I fully admit that I don’t know everything. I don’t have all the answers.

Which I feel like makes it almost easier because I’m just so open to collaboration. And I’m open to learning. So it’s a very like, it’s just a really good collaborative atmosphere.

Like everybody’s on the same page, like design wise, staging wise, the cast is amazing. So it’s kind of been like, it’s early days still. Like I got back into town, like not too long ago.

But yeah, that’s how it came about. I just was audacious and asked and guess some part of me thought I was ready. And here we are.

I mean, for directors, I mean, a lot of people think they have to know everything, but some of the best directors that I’ve worked with are like, I don’t know. What, what do we think? Yeah. That’s a more collaborative environment then.

I know the answer. Yeah. And both are right.

Neither is, you know, one is maybe not better than the other. I think there’s room for all different styles of, of leadership. And as long as I feel like if you can communicate clearly and supportively, like my kind of goal is for us to all learn from each other and learn together.

But I have, I have ideas and I have a vision of what I think the show is and what I want certain things to be like. And, and then I communicate that to like my choreographer or my music director or my fight choreographer. And then they take that and turn it into, they, they use the language that, that they know.

I don’t know. I’m not a, I’m not a dancer. I can pretend to be one, but like, I don’t.

My choreographer Amanda sees these beautiful pictures and just, that’s why I was like, I want to work with you because you communicate very well and are very positive. And she has a great, you know, uh, aura about her and she sees beautiful pictures. And so I trust her to do that.

And I learned from her and we work together. Like it’s, yeah, my goal is just kind of to be as specific as I can, but also if I don’t know something, I’ll, I’ll, I have a great assistant director as well. Who’s directed before, uh, who’s a U of T student and she’s fantastic.

So it’s been really like, I’ve already been learning so much, but yeah, my kind of thing is to just be, be confident in what I do know and honest when I don’t and be open to collaborating and trust the people that I brought on to the team to do their job as well, because I, I don’t know how to do what they do, which is why we’re working together. Well, that, I mean, nobody can do everything in theatre. But can’t we try, don’t we all? If you’re going to lose your mind, which is a quick road to trying to lose your mind.

Oh, I lost mine, but it’s been a really good exercise in delegation as well. I mean, like you, I’m going to, you do that. Cause I’m just so used to self-producing my own stuff or being in my own stuff.

And my designer was like, stop volunteering to do things. You’re not going to do that one thing. I’m like, but I, okay, okay.

That is actually a tough lesson to learn. If you’re used to like fringe or self-producing where you do do everything. Well, the first time we did Rocky Horror at the Lower Ossington, like a long, long time ago, I did all of the things, all of the things.

And like, I was happy to do it because I was very specific in what I wanted. And you know, the infrastructure wasn’t in place yet to have a team of people. So I was like, yeah, I can do that and that and that and that.

But it’s like, now that there are other people that are capable of doing it, you’re taking away what their function is and not undermining their abilities, but I guess kind of, and then, and then I’m not focusing on the art that I’m supposed to be doing and the pictures I’m supposed to make in the story I’m there to tell. So it’s been really great trusting people to hand things off to and then doing what I need to do in the rehearsal. So there’s more than one thing happening, but also being there to like, listen to them, rehearse vocals or watch them do, you know, and have input and like consult as we go.

But it’s been a really like, it’s been a really ideal experience so far. And Hard House for me, like when I did it the first year when we did Reefer Madness, it was so special. I don’t know if it’s because it was my first show in the city, it was my first lead.

And it was just such a special group of people and that creative team were amazing. They were fantastic. And they made it something really meaningful.

And so for me, I feel like being back there, directing my first show now where I performed my first show here, in that environment, it’s special to me too, especially because it’s full circle, but also that, that theatre, there’s some kind of magic in that, in that basement, you know, and it’s important to me to make it a special and empowering experience while telling this story that is so important right now. Yeah. What was your first exposure to Heather’s? Was it the musical? It was the movie.

The movie. Excellent. Good.

1989. Yeah. So I love Winona Ryder.

And I was, I’ll admit it, I was a Shannon Doherty fan, even though she was a total, you know, typecast is not the nicest person. But I loved her. I thought it was so cool.

So I, yeah, I read about Heather’s in a book. I don’t know what book it was. But I just remember this like, image of Shannon Doherty with the shoulder pads and the croquet mallet and the like, 80s glasses.

And I was like, what is this? And then I like, looked into it because you know, when things used to be in books and not we didn’t have the internet, which is a fun thing to talk about with my cast, because they’re all in their 20s. So I think we have like one or two casts that were alive when the movie came out. Are they playing teachers and dads? Well, I mean, you need to have them.

But I put together this like document of 80s references for them just to be like, you know, of course, you’re like, watch these TV shows. And like, here’s the top movies of the 80s. And just like going back there was like, such a, such a trip, just to see like all the things.

But yeah, my first exposure to it was was the film. I think I was, I was too young to really appreciate it. But then when it came out as a as a musical, I was like, Oh, yeah.

And they’re like, it’s the original Mean Girls, which it it’s the original a lot. It is it is because the first time I saw Mean Girls, I was like, huh, this is a lot like Heather. I feel like I’ve seen this before.

Murder. But yeah, yeah. And there’s spoiler alert.

There’s I mean, the movie came out in like 8089. Yeah. So I think the spoiler embargo, I guess.

Well, I mean, you tell us. But I mean, I think that the musical is a little more on its message than the movie is. Yeah.

And I think a lot of that is is they rewrote it in 2011. I want to say. And if you look at the events leading up, it’s almost it’s Yeah, like it’s really, it’s almost it gives us a different perspective.

After seeing all of the stuff that’s happened, especially in the States. We’ve been a bit more fortunate up here. Mind you, not perfect by any means.

But it’s, it’s interesting, like, especially to be doing it right now. Like, it just feels very I don’t know what the word is. But it feels like it’s just this is the time that we need to tell the story, especially when like, you know, funding for mental health is in question.

We have like what just happened in the city not too long ago. And the government talking about like, firearms and funding and all of this stuff, like we’re, it’s a time we need to talk about it. And it’s a great way to talk about it, you know, with singing and dancing, but making it making it palatable.

Because I read this thing like we don’t, we don’t joke about and laugh about things that are like in the face of things that are pleasant and fun. We laugh in the face of things that are difficult and hard to deal with. And that’s, I think what Heathers is, it’s a really good mix of amazing musical numbers and choreography and, you know, a tribute to the film, but it’s also got this message of how important it is to treat each other with kindness and empathy and compassion and not to be divided and against each other, because we can’t make any change if we’re fighting one another.

And so it’s this beautiful like view through the eyes of a 17 year old, who I like to think is kind of a, I feel like Veronica Sawyer is like a cross between like Dorothy Gale from The Wizard of Oz and Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Yes. You know, like she’s got these ideals that are like, she goes through every emotion ever.

And it’s like, well, this is right, and this should happen. But this isn’t happening. And it’s like, happy, sad, happy, sad, but also she’s like, totally badass.

So it’s a good mix of that. And I love a story with a strong female heroine, you know, and I think we need that in the world now too, like with all the, just yeah, it feels like a really good time to do it. But yeah, to answer your question, the movie in 89 is when I started to like it, well, it was probably like, 94, 95, when I could really appreciate it, just before Clueless, which completely distracted me from Heathers.

Right? Yeah, I mean, when I first, I missed seeing Heathers off Broadway, like by a month. Oh, stop. Because I was going to New York, and it was just closing just before I went.

But I was completely obsessed with the music from the show. It’s a beautiful score. It is kick ass.

It’s kick ass. It’s a hard thing to like, there’s a couple of the hardest like characters, like female characters in like contemporary musical theatre, it said that in that show, but it’s just, it’s a tough saying. So like, when we were casting too, we were like, what’s your choral experience? What’s your, how are you with harmonies? Because it’s like, do a thousand part harmony at the easiest of times.

And our cast is like, they’re crushing it. They sound fantastic, but it’s a deceptively difficult score. Because it just sounds and works so well, but when you break it all down, like it’s nutty.

There’s a lot going on in those choral numbers. Yeah, there really is. And like Kevin Murphy, who did Reefer, because I love that I’m familiar with his work from before.

So I kind of am like, oh, that’s a very Kevin thing. Oh, this is, this reminds me of this, or this is like an iconic moment that kind of mirrors this other song. But they’re very clever in the way that it’s written in that everything’s intentional.

And so we listen to the music and compare it to the action, compare it to the narrative at the time, and it’s just brilliantly done. And it’s also succinct. And I mean, I guess that’s most musicals, like it’s supposed to be that way.

It should be that way. It should. Yeah.

And it’s just like the themes that recur in it coming back and forth and like, looking at it, not as a performer doing one track, but looking at it as almost like a puppet master. And how do I make all of these things work together? It’s very, very clever. Yeah, it’s beautiful.

There’s some beautiful songs with beautiful lyrics that I just like, Portuguese, I get emotional about a lot of things. But like, I just listened to it at the gym, reading my script, and I’m just like, a mess, like crying on the treadmill. Okay, anyone who knows me knows that I don’t use the treadmill.

But it’s yeah, it’s very moving. Yeah, they’ve done a really good job. It’s very, very moving.

It’s clever in that, in that, I mean, the first act has some of the most, I don’t know, Candy Story is a rocking song. That is like, a kick ass song. And our girls are amazing.

Like it’s, yeah, we Yeah, it’s, it’s nutty. But they kind of like, for me, like, I love rock musicals. And I grew up watching Andrew Lloyd Webber.

Like that’s, I’m from a small town and grew up going to Ottawa to like National Arts Centre to see all the tours that came through. But my first big one was coming to see Phantom in Toronto at the Pantages. So I grew up with that like, larger than life, like fantastical mega musical era.

Right. And to me, Heathers has so many of those aspects as well. And like, I love rock musicals, like Rent is one of my favourite musicals.

I’ll say it. I like it. Um, there’s no reason not to also know.

Um, I’m proud to do it like it. Um, but it has lost my train of thought thinking of rent. Um, yeah, so for me, what I want to do with it too, is to make all the musical numbers are larger than life, especially in the open, like the first act, it’s almost like into the woods that way.

Yes. Where the first act and the second actor are quite different in tone. Yeah.

But like Candy Store, Dicker Walking, like, we want to make them like, it’s like rock concerts with scenes in between. So like, Candy Store is very like Madonna, almost. So we’ve got this like fierce, you know, thing.

And it was very inspired by like the ballroom battles in New York City in the 80s. Like, because that was a huge parallel we drew between like, the Heathers and they’re like facade to be popular and what the principle of like the battles were back then of like, prestige and, and, and, and aesthetic and, you know, character one upping each other. And, you know, so yeah, it’s, it’s an epic, it’s act one is epic, for sure.

I mean, they both, they both are. It’s a lot. But that’s kind of our set is incredible.

And like our lighting designer is also incredible. I worked, I’ve worked with both of them. And I’m, you know, we’ve got this amazing setup that’s really, I think, going to reflect that like, 80s pop rock, you know, nice concert feel.

Yeah, which is going to be great. Like when they did Hedwig last year, I which was one of my another one of my favourite shows. I find it very, it’s almost kind of similar to that in that we hear Hedwig story and we go through her narrative.

It’s the same with Veronica. It’s like, this is what happened here. And then I went through this, and then this, and then this.

And like, how do we get to who she started to who she how it how she ends up right in the journey that she takes. And it’s similar. And I wanted to have that like, rock concert feel because I’m a big like, I’m a big rock girl.

Like I love, you know, one of the things I appreciate about the musical, because the movie sort of drops you in, she’s already a Heather. Yeah. And the musical gives you like, a backstory.

Which is like, I think this is actually, that’s how you start this musical. Yeah, yeah. Because it’s like, you would think being popular would be easier than being not popular.

But then you get a look from the inside, like the belly of the beast almost like is, is it worth it? Is the price of popularity worth it? Yeah. Which is something you know, and, and I think these musical numbers are so massive, the way they’ve written them, because when you’re a teenager, it’s always the end of the world. Yeah, everything that happens is the end of the world.

And I see it with my music students a lot that they get, especially when I used to teach in schools, just the things that kids get upset about. And it’s like, I know, it’s not a big deal. But to them, it’s everything, because their scope is so narrow.

So it’s interesting, because it’s a commonality that the entire company has, we all were in high school. Well, it’s funny, because our Veronica was homeschooled. So she never went to high school.

So we’ve been chatting about like the dichotomy of like cliques and politics in high school and this and that. And it’s been really interesting. For Yeah, isn’t that? Yeah, interesting.

Yeah, she is. She’s amazing. Her name is Emma Singalley.

And she’s a star like everybody in the company is a star, though, which is the thing, but it’s it’s important to have, you know, characters that you care about. And in reading Kevin’s notes about the show, like, it’s important, we want to give a reason to care about these people, even if they are mean, or violent, or cruel, or dumb, seemingly, like, nobody’s that way, just to be that way. So like, why? Why are we? Why? Why is it? And through caring about them, we connect with them.

And we want, you know, it just, it’s a bigger investment for people, which I guess is the point. But yeah, I think the musical numbers are big, because that’s, that’s what it’s like being a teenager. Everything is like, oh, yeah.

And the changes, the emotional changes are so quick, because it’s like one minute. Oh, my God, I’m so happy. Oh, my God, it’s the end of the world.

Oh, my God, I don’t know how I can live another day. Oh, my God, I love you so much. Oh, I hate you.

Oh, you know, I want to be your friend. Oh, no, don’t look at me again. Like, it’s a lot.

So and I tell the cast to I’m like, this show is a lot. So you need to like, it’s very important that everybody is very kind to themselves. It’s like we need to make an agreement to, to take care of each other while we go down.

It’s kind of like this dark rabbit hole of content, because it’s a lot. And they’ve been they’ve been doing such a great job so far. But yeah, we’ve all been there.

Yeah, for the most part. So going back, there’s been it’s been a trip. I’ve forgotten a lot of things about high school until we started this show.

Oh, God, I remember that guy. I think we’re supposed to forget about high school. I think it’s best that way.

You know, my head doesn’t miss the space to take up. I’m sure there’s something more rational in there somewhere. But it’s it’s interesting.

It’s interesting. And it hits all the like archetypes of the high school hierarchy. And, you know, we talked about like, where did you fit in? Where would you have been? And how would you have felt about this person or that person? And it’s Yeah, it’s interesting.

It’s really interesting. I think I think it’s, I mean, I guess it’s good to go back and reconnect to where you came from or not. Like, I don’t know, I guess it kind of depends on how your high school experience was.

How you feel about it? Yeah, well, that’s how we started today. I was like, anybody actually like high school? And some people like, yeah, and I’m like, anyone not? And they were like, yeah. And some people didn’t have an opinion.

And I was like, that’s fine. I was like, when you’re, you know, you don’t have to. Yeah, I’m trying to be very, very gentle with how we talk about things just because it’s, we deal with a lot of issues in the show.

So it’s like, the more comfortably and at their at everyone’s own pace that we can deal with it, I think the more authentically we can tell the story just by being really gentle and not freaking anybody out or expecting anybody to react or say or do anything. It’s like, we’ll kind of roll at the pace that that is comfortable for us as a company making that agreement. And I learned this from James Wallace, who directed Titus last year.

And he did a talk. And that is a very dark show as well. And not to say like, if anyone doesn’t know, Heather’s, it’s not like a terrible, dark, depressing show.

There’s a lot of comedy and lightness and music and song and dance in it, too. But there are moments. But he was like, you know, as a company, we tap into rehearsal, we do the thing.

And then as a company, we tap out of rehearsal, and we go on with their lives. So I was like, I think that’s very important for us to adopt as well. You know, we have a great like fight choreographer and intimacy coach is going to help with with a lot of the stuff, which was very important to me as well.

Yeah. Yeah. No, it’s a lot.

When things get dark, I think, and a lot of times we, a lot of productions don’t think about when people leave rehearsal and taking care of themselves. And people can carry shit around if you don’t let it go. Well, that’s the thing.

And I have my own experiences with like mental health and this, that and the other. And when you’re singing, like the lyrics in our rehearsal today, we had a full day of rehearsal. And a lot of it was very aggressive.

So I was like, Okay, make sure you go home and do something nice, whatever that means to you. Try your best to leave this here, because this is a play at the end of the day, try and whatever that means to you, because taking care of your voice is very important for the show. Taking care of yourself physically is very important.

I was like, but emotionally, mentally, it’s also important to balance and we try to keep the room light. Yeah. And we do and my music director, Justin McLean, and I are very good foils to each other.

I think we make a good team that way. And everybody on the team is just very keeping it light, keeping it bright, and giving people the space to to explore those darker, like lyrics and scenes without it just being like, Oh, my God, this feels like a Shakespearean tragedy. Yeah.

Which, you know, it I guess in moments it is, but I I definitely want people to not take it home with them. Because it is. It’s a it’s a lot of time it is but ultimately, the show is a lot of fun, right? It’s a it’s a mega musical.

It’s like, you know, it is a dark comedy, but it is a comedy. And I coming from the musical theatre background I’ve come from, like, depending on what the audience is, we’ve got some little like Easter eggs that are from different musicals. So we’ve got something for the musical theatre crowd.

And then we’ve got like a bunch of stuff for people that are coming because of the movie. So I feel like there’s a little something something for everybody. Because I am a child of the 80s.

I love the 80s. And I love musical theatre. And at the end of the day, it’s a musical.

And there are things in it that gets there. It’s fantasy. There are these numbers that are just blown out of proportion, because that’s what the high school mind is like, Oh, my God, he held my hand.

Oh, and it’s it’s the emotional. It takes up the emotional space of say, a song and dance number. So that’s been a lot of fun to keep the humour and the lightness and the fact that it’s a musical comedy.

Yes, it is. It does deal with things. But that dark subject matter is, is just a catalyst for the message.

Like through these tragedies, are we learning the importance of togetherness and compassion and kindness and, and, you know, so those those dark things are aspects of it. But at the end of the day, yes, it’s a it’s a musical comedy with a beautiful message that’s very important for us to tell the world. And I, and I told the cast that too, I’m like, you know, this song sounds silly, and it is silly.

You know, this song or that song, but the message is very important. So yeah, keep the message authentic. And then we’ll we’ll dress it up.

You know, the the notes and the choreography are like accessories to the message. And it seems to be they’re striking a really beautiful balance. It’s very exciting to see it already come together and the different journeys that they’re all on.

And even just in the opening number itself, I love it because you see, you see the armour of high school students, and then you see the truth behind it, like right away, which really sets up us up for for the journey of every character in the show. It’s a beautifully written show. Like it’s really well done.

Yeah, it’s a privilege. It really is a privilege to lead a group doing this show. Good.

Yeah. Well, what is your theatre origin story as a girl who grew up in a small town and went to Ottawa to see some shows at the NAC and saw Phantom at the Pantages Theatre? What? The first time I saw Phantom. What was it that made you want to do it? Oh, I think I think careers in the arts kind of choose you.

I’ve always sang, I’ve always danced, I’ve always like put on plays at home, like Fred Penner was my first concert when I was two. That totally dates myself, although I’ve already said that Well, listen, we’re 80s kids in this room right now. Right? Yeah.

So yeah, I was raised with music always, like Sharon Wilson Bram and, and, and like I said, like Fred Penner and all that kind of stuff. So I went to see it was my first concert and I like cried because I was so overwhelmed as I was there and he was right there. And then yeah, I don’t know how I got onto Phantom but like, I had the cassettes and I had all the memorabilia.

I was obsessed. I was obsessed. Yeah.

And we came to Toronto when I was six or seven and came to see it here. And I just, just it doesn’t get more epic, really, to me. I guess Les Mis is pretty epic, too.

But I’m, I’m a Phantom child. So to me, like, how much bigger do you get starting a show with a giant organ and a chandelier? Spoiler alert if you haven’t seen Phantom. If you haven’t seen Phantom by now.

How many 80s are we going to ruin for people? Ruining all the 80s. Stay tuned, guys. We’re going to ruin all the 80s.

All the 80s. And you’re welcome. So yeah, I just, I was so overwhelmed by it.

So I couldn’t even tell you why I just think it and I came, we came here, we spent two days here, me, my mom, my dad, my grandma. And I was just like, this is what I want to do. I want to be part of this epic magic that is pretend, you know, and theatre was really helpful when like, my parents split up and my grandparents passed and I switched schools and I was, you know, this, that and the other thing.

I always regardless of what I gained or lost interest in music and theatre is the one thing that’s been consistent and the one thing I can connect from my life now to my life when I was a kid, which I think, and like you said, we forget high school. But like, what is the we all have that through line? Yeah. And we can always reconnect and that is theatre and music.

And I know that I’m on the right path. Because I mean, yes, I’ve seen Phantom about 1000 times. And I will see it 1000 more.

And I and I’ve met and worked with so many people I saw in that production. And my director that I just worked with David Rogers was in it. Like he was the Phantom.

He was Raul when I saw it first. So to have met and be working with these people to me, I mean, I’m a geek for that. Do you ever when you end up working with these people? Do you have a moment of like, when you’re gonna you’re like, I’m gonna fangirl.

Yeah, so my first year at Sheridan, June Crowley started as a teacher, like a private teacher. And I was like, Oh my god, I hope I get her. Then they paired me with her.

I was like, what are the And the first day we had like a warm up. She’s like, do this. I was like, like an idiot, like a goddamn idiot.

Luckily, she thought it was nice, which was nice of her. But yeah, I’ve met and worked with so many of the cast from like the first couple Phantoms and, and yeah, it’s been really special. And that I’ve thought about quitting a number of times.

I think we all do. Because it’s, it’s hard. Nobody would choose to do this.

Like, yes, I’m going to struggle and wonder if I’m going to work a week from now or a month from now or not be able to ever go out and see my friends because I need to be on vocal rest or this, that or the other thing. But I think it chooses us. And I think to you have to want it that badly to tailor your entire life.

Yeah, you know, people like, Oh, you’re so lucky to do this. I’m like, well, here’s the breakdown. Yes.

Let me know. I think you’re lucky to have your job that has regular hours and benefits and a pension and this and that you’re so like, I don’t think people think of it the opposite. Yeah.

I think people who say that you’re so lucky. I think a lot of those people may have been people who were when they were in high school, they were thinking, Oh, I like doing this theatre thing, but there’s no future in it. So they went into business or yeah.

And so in their minds, they’re thinking about like the fun, the glamor, all those things that were great about it in high school and not about the complicated taxes that we all do. The, you know, all of the, all of the stresses, the, the, you know, am I making enough? Can I afford my apartment? I have roommates, all the things that we, that we, that, that, that people in theatre are struggling with. Yeah.

Yeah. And I have to remember that because sometimes like my girlfriends and I talk about it because I have one friend, she’s a singer and God, she gets it a lot. She’s like, I swear to God, if a more person was like, yeah, I get it.

But I guess, yeah, it’s important to in the, in the, you know, vein of having compassion for one another that Heather’s is all about trying to be like, okay, you, you mean, well, I’m going to assume you mean well and just try to, but I, you know, lucky, I do think luck has something to do with it. Luck, talent, work ethic, timing. I think it’s like a, you know, fruit salad of things that has to happen, but I mean, yeah, luck is it, but yeah.

Yeah. I think that, I think it chooses us. I think we feel compelled to do it.

I think we have to do it. It’s an extension of who we are and how we express ourselves. And we were talking earlier about introvert, extrovert, and many performers are introverted.

Yes, because theatre and music is how we communicate. And when we’re not, yes, I get, I don’t speak for everybody, but I know for me, like when I’m on stage in that capacity or in a character, that is how I express myself. And I have to do it.

Otherwise, like, like when I just finished a contract with Drayton and we were backstage and there was this bit where we had this like musical ride and everyone was wearing these like horse pants, like they were all Mounties and I hadn’t done a voiceover in a couple of weeks. So I gave them all voices. I was like, guys, I haven’t had a session in a couple of weeks, so I really need to get this out of my system.

Otherwise I’m going to explode. So I gave six horses different voices, but just to the adage of we, I think we need to do it and it’s important to do it. So I think, yeah, I think it’s something that we need to do.

And there are different aspects and there are different aspects of what I do. And, and I feel like I have struck a really brilliant balance and I’m very, very grateful for the work that I do and the variety of work that I do. But yeah, I think, I think it’s something that we’re called to do.

I think so. I mean, you’re so lucky. Those people, I, the way that I kind of feel sad because they think that they’re people who gave up on their dream.

Very, very young. Well, I’m ruining your table. It’s a shitty table.

Don’t even worry about it. It’s a beautiful table. Well, then I, it looks like an Olympic sidebar.

So yeah, I mean, we are called to do it. And I mean, I did quit for like five years. I quit doing any theatre for about five years.

I burned out on some stuff and then was like, well, I don’t want to do that. And a very astute friend at a certain point was like, I’m doing as you like it. And I would like you to be touchstone.

It’s like, she knew what my weakness was going to be, like touchstone was going to be my weakness. And I was like, I can’t do that. I don’t do that anymore.

And she was like, just once, just, just do it. Cause I think you’ll have a good time. And then I was like, I did it.

And I was like, the doors open and just one hit, just one hit. And it’s, it’s hard to give up. And the number of people I’ve talked to, a lot of people who, who, who went into it and quit, they do something because they can’t not, they have to, if they’ve given it up entirely, nobody can give it up entirely.

No, not, not, not happily. No, I don’t think. No, it’s true.

How do you feel about like, so, I mean, you’re, how many rehearsals have you had for Heather so far? I’ve been back for a week. So you’ve been back for a week. I’ve been back for a week.

They’ve been about a week and a, well, I’ve only missed one really. So we’re about a week and a half in proper rehearsal. Yeah.

How does, how does being the, like, how does it feel to say you’re the director? Insane. Nutty, nutty. I think the heart has lost their mind.

No. I feel grateful. I feel like, so here’s the thing, like, I feel like, and I’ve been told that women of a certain age in theatre, musical theatre, TV, there’s this like black hole where people don’t really know what to do with you.

And I was like, how do I avoid that? Cause like when I was in theatre school, they’re like, 20% of you will make it now or 70% of you or 80% of you will, will not make it. Yes. I corrected myself from 70 to 80, whatever, whatever.

Make it whatever. Yeah. And I was like, screw that.

I’m going to do it. Yeah. And I did.

Cause I’ve always kind of been like, oh yeah, watch me. Um, cause I’m stubborn. Uh, so I was like, how do I make that work for me? And also, cause I didn’t know if I was going to lose my voice or not, but I was like, how do, so I think for me, it’s also something that I wanted to look to for the future in a way to continue working in a creative field.

How does it feel to say it? I don’t know. It’s a, I feel very proud. I feel very privileged.

I feel very grateful. Uh, I feel like they will all worship. Isn’t that why you go into it? No, I’m kidding.

So to be honest at this point, uh, while I’m speaking to you today, it’s been mostly music and choreography because so much of it is these huge production numbers. And, and the challenge with this show is it is, uh, it is a musical number with scenes and fights and choreo and staging. So it’s, it’s insane.

I think we’re all nuts. Um, cause we get, because of the structure of the theatre, we get two evenings and a weekday or a weekend day with this cast, which is why I’m so grateful to have such a brilliant cast. Cause we really don’t have a lot of time to put it together, but they’ve really like committed and bought into, you know, the message and, and, and what our intention is doing the show to say it.

So I haven’t, I’ve really just kind of, no, it’s been cool. Cause I I’ve, I’ve consulted with like my choreographer and we sat down and we’re like, well, what do you think of this number? What is your inspiration? What do you have in mind for this? And I’m like, well, I think that this number is inspired by this style of dance or from this show, or I’d like it to reflect this number. And then these are a couple of things I’d really like to happen within it to further the story or support the narrative.

So we’ve worked together that way. And then I’ve kind of been there to like consult as we go. Same with music.

I’m like, well, this, you know, this is, we’ve worked on it, like intention and, and what we’re talking about as we sing these songs, but I’m trying just not to step on anybody’s feet right now. But this week, like if we did this next week, I could probably have more to tell you, but this week I start doing scenes. So today I did a lot of work with my assistant director being like, here’s what I have in mind for this and this.

And how does this look like just getting a second opinion? Because I, I don’t, I don’t know if what I think actually makes sense outside of my head. So we’ve been doing a lot of that, but the work I have done, even just in auditions and callbacks has been, has been really educational, like teaching me, realizing how much I, I actually do know what I’m talking about sometimes and which I maybe discredit myself for more than I should. Um, it, it feels right.

It feels good. It feels like this is a good show for me to do. I mean, God, I think it’s insane that it’s a 20 person, like mega musical, but I’ve never been one to, to dip my toe and it’s all or nothing.

All or nothing, you know, no three person little musical for you to start. No, maybe I, I mean, I was the assistant to the director on the show I just did, which was really, which was really insightful. Um, but yeah, I, it feels, it feels like it’s a good situation.

Yeah. Yeah. It feels good.

I’m very excited. I’m very excited. I’m very excited about it.

Is there anything that’s similar about directing, uh, to curating? You curate the, uh, the studio 120 or the, the 120 diner? Yeah. The Sunday cabaret series. Yeah.

Well I’ve been, yeah. So I’ve been, and that’s another thing that kind of was like, can I do this? Cause I teach voice privately and I’ve been mentoring a lot of young artists for their cabaret. So I was like, it’s kind of a transferable skill.

I’d like to think like, cause I’ve been with my students that do musical theatre. I’ve been helping them with, with doing text work and doing staging and this and that in small bits here and there. And same with like my, my, I used to teach groups of younger kids and that’s directing small cast.

There’s my three person musical was my recital last year. So it’s kind of a thing that I’ve been doing and yeah, mentoring these artists for their cabarets and answering questions and giving ideas, but allowing just being like, well, consider this or consider this. And then they take that and they make it, you know, they translate it into their own language and then they put it into their own physicality and they, and they do it.

And it’s been awesome. Like I get the same sense of pride in them in my cast now, as I did or do with my students or with the artists that I mentor some, a lot of which are actually in my cast, which has been awesome. Yeah.

So it’s, I would say there are a lot of transferable skills and, and I think really a thing that is important is to trust the people you’ve hired and give them credit that they have something to offer as well. So that’s been easy to, to just be like, show me how you interpret this. And then we’ll go from there and giving suggestions and letting them realize it on their own, because I feel like it makes for a very authentic performance, you know? Yes.

Like there’s fine tuning here and there obviously, but, but it’s been a really exciting process to see, to see them real, make these realizations and make these choices and ask questions. Like there’s one guy in my cast who asks the best questions, you know? And it’s, yeah, I think there’s a lot of parallels and a lot of like, things that are very directorial in teaching and in the artist mentoring and in, you know, even hosting and watching, watching people and encouraging people. Because at the end of the day, the director is the leader and a good leader, you know, is, is on the level with their crew or with their team or whatever, leading at the same level.

And I feel like we’re all very much on the same page and at the same, on the same level. Because that’s, I mean, would I have a different answer if I had five years of Stratford as a director under my belt? Probably, but for where I am now, yeah. Yeah.

It’s, it’s been interesting just realizing, oh, I’ve done this before in this capacity. So yeah. How long did you host the Monday Nights at Statler? Monday Nights we did for seven years.

Seven years. Yeah. So we’re, we’re on a hiatus and then, you know, we’ll be, we’re going to relaunch hopefully in the fall.

Where did that come from? That was, so Jenny Burke, who’s a brilliant musical theatre performer, hosted it, the last incarnation of Statler’s and then the venue closed and reopened and they, Jenny was out of town doing her own thing and has been doing her own thing nonstop since. She is amazing and such an inspirational powerhouse. And they, you know, I was asked if I would be interested and I said, yes.

And then we turned it into a beautiful community. And we have like the backdoor awards, which we may still have this summer. I’m still getting my footing after being gone for so long, but, but yeah, it was a beautiful community that we built.

And, and like you said, for people who don’t maybe perform as a career, it was a place for them to come in and be among like-minded people and they get to perform and have a good time and kind of still have their finger on the scene sort of thing. So that, yeah, it was, it was divine. Intervention or just a, you know, it was a nice gift and I learned a lot from it and we, I met a lot of people and we did a lot of really great collaborations.

Yeah, it was a really special, it was a really special thing and, you know, we’re going to see what the future of it is. I don’t know at the moment, but, you know, it was really the community outpouring for support of it was, was really great. So we’ll see where that goes, but it was a really great experience for a lot of people.

I’m very proud of it. Is there a particular lesson that you can think of that you learned from the Statler’s performance, the, like the open mic? That’s a very good question. A lesson I’ve learned.

I’ve learned that the Toronto performance community is strong and special and when you need them, they are there. Whether you realize it in the moment or not, it is a beautiful community of people and I’m very proud to be part of it. I’m very proud to have played any role in its support.

And yeah, I’ve learned that this city is full of brilliantly talented and supportive, kind people, I think is the best thing. And like, and I learned how to like shut down hecklers. That was a big one too, but that was a big lesson.

Not near the end, but near the beginning, I can remember. And actually this was when I was talking to Glenn Sumi last year, when we did our fringe article, I brought this up too. I remember one of my first nights, we were still kind of trying it out and I was doing, it was like a test kind of cabaret night that I did just as like a cabaret cabaret.

And the kind of the art is songs and stories that support each other and tell a bigger story. So I was telling a story and I’d sung a song and this drunk guy at one of the tables was like, shut up and sing. And that is exactly what you just did right now.

So Phil just closed his eyes and looked mortified. I shut down. I can’t like the most, I think on stage rehearsal, like I can shut down in rehearsal depending on what we’re doing, but on stage I’m generally pretty good.

But I just, you could see every like bit of love and joy just draining from me. So building up my thicker skin and being able to deal with it with a sense of humour and not be a dick back to them because it’s like, you’re clearly miserable. I am not.

So I am not going to punch down. Rather find a way to work with it. Find a way to work with it.

That’s not, yeah, that’s not punching down. So I learned how to punch up, I would say. And I think, and I’ve done more hosting since I started doing that show.

And that’s really been helpful just in general to have that skill of taking something someone says that may be somewhat offensive or off colour or something in and just changing it up because it was really important to me to make the vibe of that show supportive and empowering and safe. So that was, I was like that, and that was a big motivation of it. I was like, I never want to be spoken to like that again.

And I don’t want anyone at my show to be spoken to that way. So kind of setting the example of be kind, be supportive. This is a safe space.

You definitely, I was listening to, because Chelsea Johnson’s podcast did an episode where they aired. They did, yeah, we collaborated on two parts. It was a great couple of nights that we did.

And hearing, because you could hear like you dealing with people. And no, because it was a really positive way to deal with people, people talking, people like just generally the way that you dealt with an unruly crowd of people who were drinking and singing. It was really quite good.

Thank you. Yeah. And I mean, there’s always that like, kind of double edged thing of regular patrons at the bar on one side, and then our kind of audience on the other side.

So mediating from the people who don’t give a shit to the people who do give a shit. And it’s like, how do we, and anytime I’ve learned, you can’t beat them, ignore them. So I was like, anytime they were unruly, and it happened from time to time, it was never too bad.

But I mean, it is a bar at the end of the day, shit’s gonna happen. So I was like, you know, sing to us, we’re listening. Ignore the people that don’t care.

Focus on the people who do, which is a good, I think we’ve learned a lot of transferable life lessons within that little pot of safety, right? Like, you can’t please everybody. Fuck them, like, ignore them. They’re not worth your, that’s energy you won’t get back, it will never cycle back to you.

But if you invest in people who are investing in you and listening to you and taking you in, you are going to get it back, instead of it just being draining. And there are some nights that are slower than others. And it’s difficult, and it’s draining.

But generally, like, we were able to establish a vibe in that room that was very energy, energy exchange, right? And so yeah, I appreciate you saying that, because that was my number one priority. I tell them, I’m like, the world is hard enough. Let’s be nice to each other in here.

Whatever happens after that, or before that, I can’t control. But the three hours I get you, let’s do this. Let’s be a team.

And let’s go for it. Which is what I tell my cast, you know, I’m like, I get you for five hours a night, let’s do the thing. Let’s be a team.

Let’s make this happen. And then let’s celebrate each other. So it’s, yeah.

But thank you for saying that. That’s very important to me when we were doing that show. Absolutely.

Where can we find you online? Online? Well, I have a website, jenniferwalls.com, that we’re going to be updating soon. I’m really bad with that. But I’m also on the Instagram, Jenny Walls, T-O-J-E-N-I.

And I don’t use Twitter that much anymore. I just kind of link it to my Instagram now that I know how to use Instagram. I didn’t even have my own account until like a few months ago.

I had one for the show. And then I was like, you can have two Instagram accounts. Because when we did it the first time, you could only have one.

And that’s actually a relatively recent thing. I know. Well, thank you Jenna Warner for showing me.

She would co-host my show when I was away. And she also works on my social media and has been really brilliant in helping me figure out how it all works. Because I know the 80s.

Do I know that the social media is now? Not as much. Which is why the kids and I make a good team. I was actually thinking earlier, how difficult is it for the kids to be like, so why doesn’t she just call on her cell phone? Or like all these things that we don’t have.

We haven’t had none of that. I think they did their research. There are scenes with phones in the show, which is a lot of fun for us to source different phones, like rotary phones and those old cell phones that look like a giant cinder block.

Like Zach Morris phone. Before flip phones even. We did Clueless two years ago, Clueless Live.

My friend Michael Hughes and I, we had to get like 90s flip phone, cell phone. So this is even like, so we tackled the 90s, now the 80s. So maybe the next show I do will be in the 70s and there’ll be no phones at all.

We didn’t have phones in the 70s. We used the mail. Yeah, just the mail.

I still like using the mail. And yeah, and we have a, we have a hashtag for, for our show as well. H H H Heathers.

So like Parkhouse Heathers. We use the, the Chia theme song. Because I’m a nerd.

T O H H Heathers T O. And we have like little things here and there and bits and bobs and all that kind of stuff. So people can keep track of the show that way. Awesome.

Yeah. So there’s, yeah, there’s, it’s a lot, but it’s, it’s all very exciting. Well, I mean, it does sound like the, the whole idea of, of the, the first directing thing that you do being like this massive 20 person thing sounds like a lot, but it sounds like you’re kind of in your element, to be honest with me.

I feel pretty good. I feel, and they’re a great group. They’re really like receptive and they’re very warm and they’re very good to me.

And, and I’m very grateful for all of them. And I like high school, I’ve, I was all of like, I think we go through a million personalities in high school. So everybody, we were all, all of those people at one point or another, we were all, we all felt like the poor, like nerdy geek who gets picked on.

And we all had moments where we either felt like the popular girl, wanted to be the popular girl, hated the popular girl. Like all, so many lyrics in this show are like the inner thoughts that we all had. And so, you know, it’ll be interesting to, when the audience comes in to, to see what they identify with.

But yeah, I’m, I, at times I’m like, oh, I’m terrified. What am I doing? But then I get in there and I’m like, I love this. I love it.

I just love being surrounded by people that are excited to, to do the work and with, with a beautiful score and script. And, and yeah, like I’ve been in a bunch of shows and directed by great directors and led groups of people to do things. And, you know, like my mom says, oh, you’ve always been putting choreography to music.

And my mom doesn’t actually sound like that. She’s probably listening. Sorry, mom.

She sounds a lot more just like I do. But I think it’s, I think we’re meant to do and try things. And I think this is something that I’m, I’m somewhere I’m meant to be right now.

And I’m working my butt off to do it. And like talking to people who like directors and producers and, and actors and, you know, I went to Stratford to see shows and watch what their pictures were and watching it from a director’s point of view rather than an actor. It’s like, how would I perform that? I’m like, well, why are they standing there? And why are they looking this way? And what are they? And what is this convention? And who goes, you know, it was, it was a really exciting experience.

But I think, yeah, I think this is where I’m meant to be right now for better or for worse. But I feel very grateful that it’s happening. And, and I’m going to do my best to tell the story with a group of people that are, that have bought into it and that are trusting me with, you know, their, their work right now and their time and their energy.

And it’s, it’s great. I love it. I’m so happy.

Well, thank you so much. It’s been a lot of fun. Thanks for having me.

This has been a Homebody Productions production.