Carlyn Rhamey

Carlyn Rhamey is an actor, writer and co-founder of Squirrel Suit Productions, a theatre collective passionate about creating new work and making a positive impact on their community. Through Squirrel Suit, Carlyn wrote and performed her very first one-woman show “SAOR (Free)” on the 2016 CAFF Fringe Tour. Carlyn’s latest solo play, The ADHD project can be seen in the 2018 editions of the London, Edmonton, Victoria and Vancouver Fringe Festivals.

Carlyn is a Fanshawe College Theatre Arts graduate. Her theatre credits include “Lavinia Andronicus” in Titus Andronicus (Funeral Pyre Theatre),”Ophelia” in Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead (Passionfool Theatre), “Abigail Williams“ in The Crucible (Passionfool Theatre), performer/playwright of In Their Shoes (Squirrel Suit), “Bridget” in Moonshine (Toronto Irish Players), Shakespeare on a Subway (Spur of the Moment Shakespeare Collective). “Ophelia” in Hamlet (Fanshawe Theatre), “Sissy” in Unity (1918) (Fanshawe Theatre).

Web: www.squirrelsuit.ca
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/squirrelsuitproductions
Twitter: @SquirrelSuitT

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Transcript

Welcome to episode 126 of Stageworthy. I’m your host, Phil Rickaby. Stageworthy is a podcast about people in Canadian theatre featuring conversations with actors, directors, playwrights, and more.

You know, if you haven’t subscribed to the podcast, I’d like to remind you again that subscribing is the best way to make sure that you never miss an episode of Stageworthy. And subscribing is easy. Just go to Apple Podcasts or Google Music and search for Stageworthy and click on the subscribe button.

You can also find links directly to both Google and Apple on the Stageworthy website, and that’ll take you right to where you can click the subscribe button. If you want to drop me a line, I would love to hear from you. You can find Stageworthy on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram at stageworthypod, and you can find the website at stageworthypodcast.com. If you want to drop me a line, you can find me on Instagram and Twitter at philrickaby, and my website is philrickaby.com. My guest this week is playwright, storyteller, and performer, Carlyn Rhamey.

Carlyn will be taking her solo show, The ADHD Project, to the 2018 editions of the London, Edmonton, Victoria, and Vancouver Fringe Festivals. What have you been filling your time with? I mean, you’re busy, so what have you been filling your time with? Yeah, well, I’m in like two playwriting groups in Hamilton. I moved to Hamilton in the fall, which has been great, and so I’m doing a women’s playwriting group, and I’m developing a solo show of that with Character Mask.

Oh, shit. Yeah. I’m fascinated with that, because I have an idea for something that I think will be mask-based as well.

Yeah. It’s fun. A friend of mine lent me some masks.

I’ve been playing with them. They’re not quite right, but I signed up for a workshop that’s literally in between. It’s my one week off pretty much in the summer.

I filled it with a mask-making workshop at Stratford. Like you do. That I can’t afford, so I filled it with that, because I’m going to be doing a short workshop of it at the Mental Health Festival in Hamilton, and then I’ll be doing a full workshop presentation of the full show instead of just a piece of it in September when I come back, so that’s that.

And then with the other group, I’ve been working on the newer show, which is called Scaredy Cat from the Hamilton Fringe. Are you doing that this Fringe? Yeah. Okay, so you’re… I need to… because you’re doing the ADHD project in like… where are you doing that? I’m doing that one in London, Edmonton, Victoria, and Vancouver.

Okay. And then I’m going into the Prologue for the Arts thing to do it in schools in the fall. And Scaredy Cat is just in Hamilton.

And then the other stuff is just like little pieces. Hmm. That’s a lot of solo to keep in your head.

Yeah, it is. And then I debated whether or not like the one script with the character mask, I was like, is this a solo show? I don’t know. And so I ended up writing it being open.

You can do it as one or if an ensemble wanted to do it, I wrote it with enough detail and freedom in it, I think that a group could do it. And I like that part of it. But I think I’ll attempt to do it as a solo show just because I know the characters.

It’s all characters in a group hop. Okay. And I know all the characters, personally.

I’m curious, what is it that draws you to solo performance? Um, this solo performance, specifically? Well, I think when it started, it was like, that’s what I saw. At like, my first storytelling show was solo. And, and just seeing someone like command the stage with with all like 110% energy.

And not needing anyone, anyone else to tell a story. Yeah, I think is interesting. You know, that kind of minimalist.

Yeah. I, one of the things that I found from doing the commandment, because it was my first solo, solo show was how addictive it is. Yeah.

To be the person commanding. Yeah, that is. Because once you know you can do it, oh shit, like, and there’s really nothing like it to be like, Oh, I can take these people on a journey.

And it’s me taking them on the journey. Yeah. And there’s a special, like, intimate connection with the audience that you get when it’s just you and when you’re talking directly to them, I think.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

And I think that’s, that’s sort of like one of the one of the tricks to making a solo play work is treating the audience like you’re your scene partner. Yeah, exactly. I have seen people who who don’t seem to do that.

And I’m always I always feel a little bit disconnected. I always feel like, why am I here? Yeah, you know, but if they talk to me, instead of at me, then I’m totally drawn in. Yeah.

So your first, your first solo play was, was Sayre. Sayre. Yes.

Yes. Which I think I pronounced correctly. Yes.

Which I think most people say soar, because we transpose the. And what we were sorry, we’re recording. Yeah.

If you if you’d been like, you know what, I hate this fucking guy. You know, I would have been like, okay, so I’m just gonna I’ll be cutting that out. But I do I do prefer to, like, treat it like a conversation.

Yeah, no, this is great. That’s I was just it just clicked. And now when you brought up Sarah’s like, wait.

Yeah. Um, so Sarah is like a story, like your story. And it’s about a journey that you took after like looking for like, could you just describe? Yeah, for me? Yeah.

So I went traveling through Ireland, Scotland, England on my own for the very first time. And there’s a particular reason why I went there. And before I got before I left, I found out I got into the calf fringe.

Okay, lottery. Okay. And I didn’t have a show.

So you entered the calf lottery without anything with nothing with nothing. I didn’t think if people told me it’s gonna take 10 years to get it. I got it.

Yeah, of course. Yeah. But um, yeah, so and so I literally, yeah, got in and then left.

I think I left for the trip like a week later. And it was seven weeks and came back and wrote. I knew I wanted to write storytelling.

I wanted to write something that was a true and from my life and, and I hoped I would get something from the trip. And I ended up writing most of it is adventurous and the people I met on the trip. But it’s also why I went there.

Sure. And what happened to, to get me to that point to go somewhere on my own for the first time. I’m so glad that actually something that something happened while you were on a trip to give you a show.

Because that would have been like, come back and be like, fuck, what do I do? I was wondering about that, too. But luckily, when you I think for anyone, when you travel on your first time, anything that Oh, there are definitely stories. Yes.

Yeah. Yeah. And with me, that’s, that’s like the law of my life.

The law of your life is that shit happens. Yeah. This is what the ADHD project is about.

Well, let’s I mean, what, what is it that made you want to write about your ADHD? And what is it like? What is the what is the obviously, it’s about ADHD and having it, but what did? How did that come about? Yeah, I think I always wanted to write about that. Especially after I went back to school for educational assistance, special needs support to work with children and also special needs, which is my other passion. And after going through that, my brain started to blend that aspect with theatre.

And I knew I wanted to write my or tell my my story with ADHD and growing up with that and being in a segregated classroom and, and how that all worked out. And some things happened when I was in college, kind of learning about my diagnosis. And I wanted to talk about that.

And I ended up doing SARE first as my my first one, because I knew this one was the important one. And I wanted to make sure I had my feet wet before I dove into sure. Yeah.

Yeah. Were you died? You were diagnosed with with ADHD when you were a kid? Seven. Yeah.

When you were seven. I don’t know if they still do it. But they put you they put you in a special needs class at that point? Or did they? Yeah, so it was a segregated classroom for grades three and four.

And then integrated after that. So you do like half the day with a group of six kids and the other half with everybody else. Sure.

Did you was that was difficult to go back and forth between the two? Did they? Did other kids like, make fun of you or something like? Yeah, yeah, I talked a little bit about it in the show, actually. Just how, like, I have a line where it’s, you know, if kids said something weird or different about you in any way, they’ll either attack or pretend you don’t exist. Yes.

And, and it’s just, it’s so true to my experience. And for other people that have come to chat with me after the show, you get the label. And that’s great, because you get the resources you need.

And with a label, sometimes can come compassion from people who are educated. Yeah. But with a label comes all the other stereotypes and stigma as well.

And, and so you’re, it’s a, it’s a bitter edge sword, or double edged sword. Yeah. I mean, that’s, I take it that the kids, did you find that most kids were on the attack or on the ignore? For me, it was a bit of a blend, but a lot of the ignore.

Really? Yeah, just that whole aspect of excluding growing up in that way. I think I only had had one good friend in elementary school in my class. Did you do, were you medicated at that point? Or were you? Yes.

Yeah, I was on meds from age seven, all the way up until I went away to college. I couldn’t remember to take them anymore. That’s how I got off meds.

And what, what, what, what happened when you went off the meds? It’s hard to tell. I mean, theatre has always been something that made me focus. So even when I told my parents, you know, I’m not remembering to take them every day.

So I’m just gonna stop. They weren’t concerned because theatre was the one thing that I could hyper focus on. Other things like disorganization and forgetfulness, all those other symptoms.

I do wonder if meds would help with that. I still struggle with it today so much. You may not be alone there.

It might not be an ADHD thing. It might just be an artist thing. Yeah.

So you decided that this was like, you knew that you ultimately wanted to write this show. Your feet wet with Sare. By the way, when you were, when you were traveling with Sare, what was like, was there, did you find that there was a difference between your expectation of performing and your, and what actually happened? Like, what was your expectation of Fringe versus your, your actual experience? Yeah, that’s a good question.

I think I, I didn’t expect to be as nervous as I was to perform something deeply personal. I had that little moment right before and with ADHD project too, which was surprising, where you think I cannot go up and say this in front of people who know me and people who don’t. And was that just the first time you performed it or was it? Yeah, it was like right before.

But once you say like, wow, lock it. That goes away pretty quickly. I get, I think for Sare especially, it was crazy how many people related to the show.

It was, you know, it was personal, it was about a breakup, it was about traveling on your own, but all like pretty standard, you know, standard stories. So while I thought, you know, this is gonna be something that people have heard before, it being something that people have heard before means that they can relate to it. Sure.

Or not heard before, but they’ve experienced it. So I, so many people came up to me after and said, like, I helped them through, you know, the ending of a long friendship that they had, or the ending of a relationship that they just had, or so they just booked their ticket, or they’re going to go book their ticket now to go do it. And I did not expect that.

And I think that comes also with, like, it comes with all theatre, but especially solo work and storytelling, when you open up something. And when you connect with people. Yeah.

And you connect with people, they really feel it and they want to come up and talk with you about it. That I think is one of the interesting things about connecting with an audience in a solo play, as opposed to any other kind of play. People in my experience really want to share with you what touched them and what affected them in your performance, uh, in a way that I haven’t seen happen with other shows.

Yeah. Yeah. Especially with ADHD project.

I, I went in, I, the first performance of it, uh, was that in the soil. That’s just a workshop. The first time I ever performed it and no one had seen it.

My director hadn’t come on yet. Like it was freshly after. Cause you did, you did the, the, the, my writer’s retreat and then you were like doing it like that, like a weekend.

It was fresh, fresh out of the writer’s retreat. This is what I, I put together. I had like the script cleverly, like played out on the stage, like the titles of each story in a row.

Um, so I had a little cheat sheet and I, I went into it being like, Hey, you know, actors and performers, we, we, you have to learn from failure. This is just going to be a failure and that’s just what it’s going to be. And I, and I did it and I had no idea how it was going throughout and, and I just got through it.

And at the end, everyone, but my parents stood up and, and every single person in that room came to talk to me and it was crazy. And, but it was needed after that. I, I walked away knowing like, okay, this story has value and not only does it have value, but people need it.

So many people, people with Asperger’s were in the audience that night, also ADHD, other mental health issues. They came up and said, I’ve never seen someone tell a piece of my story on stage. Yeah.

So after that it was like, okay, now I’m doing it. I’m telling my story for other people, which kind of, uh, up to the stakes, the elevated event. Yeah.

Um, when you were doing, we were in, in Hamilton together, uh, and you were doing Sare. I was pretty impressed with your ability to just talk to people about your show. Um, as an introvert, I have difficulty doing that.

I’m like, I see a crowd of people, I see a line and now I have to go over here and sit with my head between my knees for a good few minutes and work myself up. Um, did you have, did you plan how you were going to promote the show to people or did it just come naturally to you? Uh, it’s funny that you say that actually, because, uh, the Hamilton was the fifth stop on a like overlapping tour. I did like, cause I did London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto, Hamilton.

Oh shit. And Montreal and, uh, and Ottawa overlap and it overlapped with London a little bit that year. So I mean, I didn’t, I barely flyered, I think until I got to Toronto.

Really? So that’s three fringes in. I was so nervous. I was like head between my knees to like, I don’t know how to approach someone.

And, uh, by Hamilton, I, and Sare was incredibly hard to pitch to. I mean, even the title it’s Irish for free, so it’s not even in English. Sure.

Um, and it’s hard to explain that without that show, without giving it away. Sure. Uh, I found last year I found finally got like a, a pitch down for Edmonton and Vancouver that I could use, but in Hamilton, I was just, I found I had to just have a conversation of someone to end up telling them about my show and, and selling them on it.

I am terrible at the 10 second pitch. Like I have to talk to someone for at least five minutes. That’s funny.

Cause I, I, my perception was that Carlyn really has her shit together. As far as promoting her show goes, do you just hyped up the last, last, last one. So I had to keep my off.

Um, do you identify as a, like, do you, do you think of yourself as an introvert or as an extrovert or a combination of the two? Yeah, I think a combination of the two, I think everyone is a combination of the two in a way. Like, I think I sent you this before the Myers-Briggs personality test thing, which I found really helpful. Um, that said it was, uh, I was an ENFP and then my friend got me a book on it, which has been great.

Um, so basically I get, and it’s totally true for me. I get energy from other people, um, which is wonderful, but then I don’t process my experiences until I’m alone, which is so true. Cause once I get back home after like a crazy social, uh, event or, or being outside all day and running around doing things, I get home and sometimes I just sit for a minute and think or meditate or, or just sit with my thoughts and, and that’s what I’m doing.

I’m literally processing everything that has just happened. So I, I think that’s, yeah, it’s more, yeah, a little bit more of both, I guess. Interesting.

Yeah. Interesting. Probably more extroverted.

Well, I mean, the fact that you, I mean, from what I saw, your abilities are to just engage people in conversation. Whereas I was like, okay, now I’m going to look somebody in the eye and talk about my show. You know, there’s such a, such, so much effort involved in doing that.

Um, but you went to, you, you went to Edmonton. Was it your first time at the Edmonton Fringe? How was that? It was great. I love Edmonton.

Phil, I love it. It’s funny cause it is the one fringe that I could think of in Canada that scares the shit out of me. And I’ve done it.

I’ve done it, but it still is just so massive. And yeah, I was definitely scared going into it. Um, but it’s, there’s no other fringe where you can start selling tickets before you even land.

Oh shit. That is so true. Yes.

Like just that being, knowing that like, oh, I could like, I’m going to break even and not worry about it. It is, is with a great feeling. I I’m doing a bring your own venue this year in Edmonton.

So that’s going to be a whole nother piece. Yes. Um, are you doing it at the French school? No, I’m doing, uh, what’s it called? Roots on white.

Okay. It’s right outside the hub. So yeah, it’s a great, uh, it’s in, around everything, which is great.

Cool. Um, and did you, did you do steel wheels? Did you? Yeah. I, I bought pizza there and soup and beer.

You ate there. I ate there. Wow.

A lot of us ate there. Okay. I think I only ate there once and it was, it wasn’t bad.

It was just like, it wasn’t my choice. My, my preferred eating place. It definitely wasn’t my preferred eating place.

They had some sort of spicy ramen soup though last year. That’s super good. So I did eat that quite a few times.

Um, yeah, I’ve, I’ve been doing it. It’s just so great because there’s an audience there so you can, you can, you know, you can work and you can fly her hard before your show and get a good crowd. I mean, that is one of the things that I really liked about, about both Edmonton and Winnipeg was the, the fact that fringe is this enclosed area and everybody who’s in that area is there for fringe.

And so you don’t have to wait for people to line up. In fact, in Edmonton, they almost don’t line up because they don’t have to line up for tickets, but they’re in that area. And so you can just flyer people there.

Go around. Yeah. You don’t have to explain what fringe, which you have to do in most other places unless they’re already lined up for a show.

Um, so now you’ve, I mean, you’ve done the ADHD project a couple of times and Ottawa and Hamilton. Yeah. Um, and so now you’re, now you’re going to be taking it to a bunch of other show, uh, fringes has, I mean, after you did that initial performance, after the writer’s retreat, um, how much did, did it change? Um, right after that, uh, it changed, it changed a little bit cause my director came on, um, John Patterson and he didn’t see it.

No, no. He’s never seen it. Oh really? No.

How, how, uh, explain how, how he directs it without ever seeing it. Well he’s, no, he’s seen it. Like he’s seen the show rehearsed with me.

He’s never seen it before. He will this summer though. Um, so, uh, he came on and yeah, helped with dramaturgy.

You need one more story about this. We need lots of that. Um, and, and directed, um, a lot of the character work with me cause I do do some characters in the show.

Um, but yeah, mostly like little tweaks here and there and tightening things. I worked more on it. Um, this past year, getting it ready for schools and then this fringe, we’re adding in a whole different element.

We’re going to use a projector to project actual, uh, video footage from my childhood. Um, so that’ll change it up a lot. And I think that’s, we wanted to do it last year.

We just ran out of time and I think that will, uh, put it where it needs to be. Um, that’s a, that’s a lot of changing over, over time. Um, yeah, it’s grown.

It’s grown a lot and it’s changes with every, I’m the kind of person I need to do the show in front of an audience to really get the changes in there and to figure out what’s working and what’s not. Um, so it’s hard for me to kind of go back into a room and like work on a script and then come back. So I mean doing it in Ottawa and Hamilton was super helpful and now starting to do it in the schools has been really good too.

So you, you sort of change things as you go. Yeah. So if somebody had seen Sayre in London and then saw it in Hamilton, would it have been, it would have been fairly different, especially Sayre because there started very much like, uh, this is a, this is a play and, and this is a play, but it’s storytelling about my life.

And then by the time Hamilton hit, you know, I was out there when people were coming in, I asked questions to the audience. It was way more of, of a storytelling, um, relaxed at atmosphere. We kind of took away some of the theatrics as well.

Um, but that’s when I was still playing that hybrid of a genre. Sure. And ADHD project.

Yeah. Even people have told me they’ve, they’ve seen it twice. They saw it in, in the soil and then they saw it, um, in Hamilton and every time I do it, it kind of changes.

There’s no, there’s a set script. Um, but it, so each you’ll, I hit each story usually with each show, but, uh, but it, it’s very much a conversation like we were saying before. It’s very much an, a loose conversation with the audience.

Do you, I mean, is there much tech? Cause if it changes a whole lot, it’s gotta be hard on a, on a, on a technician. I think all my shows are hard on us. I, I, I SM to a show for the first time this year.

And, and so now I understand what I’ve done the last two years. Do some apologies. Um, but, uh, so I have, uh, right now I have no tech.

Uh, um, I had tech in Ottawa. Um, and then I did a bring your own venue. Um, so I just didn’t bring in a tech for, for Hamilton last year.

So it works either way. I mean, I do it in classrooms and libraries for, for kids, so it doesn’t need any tech, but now that we’re adding the projection elements, things will need to be, no, there needs to be some, yeah, a little bit more hammered, hammered down at the very least. Certain lines will need to be.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. You certainly won’t be able to say here’s the script. It’s not going to change.

Yeah. Sometimes I go back and read my scripts. If I’m, if I had to submit it to, uh, uh, uh, some sort of playwriting contest or storytelling festival.

And I go through just to make sure it’s updated. I’m like, what is this from? Like this whole piece is I haven’t been doing this since the start. Like it’s, it’s a whole different show and I can’t believe I handed that to my technicians.

Well, you know, what’s, what’s kind of interesting, like I did a sort of like a, a polish on the script after Hamilton for the commandment. And I kind of went through, it was like, do I still say it like this? No, I don’t. Uh, and I went from start to finish and I kind of like recited and typed at the same time.

Um, it came to the conclusion that, Oh yes, I had overwritten sections and I sort of economized, but it was essentially the same, the same thing. Yeah. Um, and only afterwards I sort of added like one chunk at the end.

Yes. It’s the sitting down and doing it. That’s hard for me because I, especially ADHD project, I only had point, like there was no script.

It was all, the stories were point form written down. And then I, I practiced telling them. Yeah.

Um, well when you were at the, at the writer’s retreat, I think at the end it was like, you sort of like how to outline and you were like, well, that’s good. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean I had some pair, like some paragraphs written as, as text and then other parts. Yeah. We’re a lot of point form and, and I never go back and to my, once I start practicing on my feet and, and just telling the story, I will maybe go back and look at the script once or twice, but I’ll, I’ll just kind of leave it.

Sure. Um, so I, when I needed a full script to give to Ottawa, I was actually doing a lot of speech to text cause I just couldn’t, I mean the ADHD really affects in this case, like sitting down and typing something out that I already have memorized is physically painful. Uh, I, and I tried for a long time and finally I just had to do speech to text.

So I was walking around the streets outside to not get bored, saying my show into my phone and doing a speech to text to get the script out. Cool. Yeah.

When, when did you start writing? Uh, like just in general, like when did you become, when did you start writing and when did you start writing theatre and doing it? Well, to ask a massive question. Yeah. Uh, we did a little bit of creative writing with, uh, the wonderful Maya Ardell when I was in school, um, who does great, uh, exercises for creative writing and, and she does workshops too.

Um, and that kind of opened my eyes to it. Cause I’ve been to that point that was in my, my last year, I hadn’t really thought about writing my own work and then I really, really enjoyed that, that course in school, but I kind of just left it until, uh, two other graduates and I did our first friend show. We did a collective creation, the three of us, um, which was a lot of bits, storytelling bits and, and, uh, made up clowny bits.

It was really weird. I almost wish I had filmed it so I could go back and look at it and just try and hide my face. I did an interpretive dance piece and I don’t dance like a lot of, lot of things.

We basically wanted to like just try everything we’ve always wanted to try and never did. And that was our first friend show. But, uh, but we wrote a lot for that and that was kind of my first, um, uh, uh, trial, I guess with it.

And then after that, uh, I attempted to write a solo show for years and finally found storytelling and that I could see the endpoint of storytelling. I was like, well, I know the ending to all my stories, so it’s easier than writing a fiction play. Yeah.

And then I latched onto it and fell in love with it. What was it that made you want to do a solo play? I think it came back to like seeing, I saw a show, um, at the fringe, a solo show. And it was just so, um, jam packed with, with energy.

And I was so captivated from start to finish, which is a real rarity for me. Um, UHD. And I think for a lot of people too nowadays, like they, so many people can’t sit for more than 60 minutes anymore.

Right. Um, so in this show just captured my attention from start to finish and it was so energetic and so fun. And it was a solo storytelling show.

And it was cool to see someone be able to be themself and all their silliness and crazy hyperness on, on stage. And I saw basically you, I think you get inspired by these things by seeing yourself on stage. Sure.

I saw something that reflected me. And so that pushed me to do it. Do you remember what the show was? Yeah, I think we talked about it actually.

Uh, in the last, in the last time I was here, uh, it was the show must go on Jeff layers. Yeah. Yeah.

And then I saw, and so that started for like inspired me to start writing a solo show. And then when I saw Sam Mullins show, who’s a great storyteller on the, on the circuit, I was like, Oh yeah, you can also just stand there and tell a story and keep an audience too. So was that a tinfoil dinosaur or was that a new one? Yeah.

Untitled Sam Mullins. Yeah. He just did four stories and just, you know, just stood up there and told them and it was fantastic.

So I think it was like, over the years, there was a collection of like seeing these shows and seeing people be able to command an audience with so much energy and be themselves on stage. And, and then again, just share something from their life. That could be the simplest thing, but it creates that lovely connection with the audience.

Yeah. I wanted to, to, uh, uh, write a solo show before I even saw one because I read one, uh, same author. It was Danny McIver and it was, uh, um, wild abandoned followed by house.

And from the moment I looked at those, I was like, I can tell that this is amazing to watch. Um, I was right when I finally got to see him perform it, uh, that yes, it’s amazing to watch. And I was like, I need to do this.

Um, and you know, eventually it only took me eight years of writing to do it. Um, but what is it that, that, uh, called you into theatre? Um, you said that it was like, was it, how did you find out that theatre is what allows you to hyper-focus? Yeah. Uh, well, it’s funny.

I have this in my, in the ADHD project. The first play I ever did was in my grade seven drama class. And I put, I got to play Dopey in Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs, which was the role I wanted.

Very exciting. And, uh, that was kind of the first time where I realized like I can make people laugh. And Dopey is a super silly character and I had the best time playing it.

And at that point, I wasn’t able to be myself among my classmates. Um, it was very, very, I was very, very introverted because if I broke out of that in any way, I would be called hyper or special and not in a nice way. Um, so being able to do, being able to do theatre, uh, was me being able to be myself for the first time.

Um, so from there it just snowballed. Yeah. Um, you were, you were introverted as a child and when did you? In certain, in certain places.

Yeah. So, I mean, I was at home. I was like many kids.

I was outgoing and loud. And my parents wondered how I learned anything at school because I was always talking. And then when they found out by talking, like, I think it was in grade one and they were worried that my, my teacher would be like, Phil just won’t shut up.

And the teacher was like, he’s so quiet. And my parents were like, who’s this child at home? And so, I mean, there’s context. So were you like a chatterbox at home and like at school because of circumstances introverted or? Yeah, I was pretty wild outside of school.

I think I like tried to sit on that energy all day long. Um, I did an afterschool program with the YMCA. It was a leader core program and I would get there and be bouncing off the walls.

Um, so, and I think part, I mean, part of that’s just me and the meds wearing off at the end of the day. But, uh, uh, I think part of it’s too is, is trying to sit on it all day long, um, at school. Yeah.

Yeah. Uh, and when you were, when you were in theatre school and you were not taking your meds, um, how did that affect your theatre school experience? Um, well, even in high school and once high school hit and I was outside of that one group of people, I was pretty crazy. Yeah.

Um, I’d like to think I’ve simmered down in my old age, but yeah, after, as soon as high school hit, I was just so energetic, always like bouncing around. Um, and, and theatre school started that way too. And then there’s, you know, there’s a need for, for stillness and calm too with that.

And I think I, it helped with that. How did you find the stillness and calm? Um, that’s a daily struggle. It’s still something that I go, that I am always, uh, trying different things to, to reach.

Um, but I mean, in, in theatre school, at least they’re just the way that it was Fanshawe college, the, the way that their theatre program was kind of set up, uh, was at least the first year they gave you a lot of time basically. Um, so we had classes like voice classes where we’d have a, you know, a two hour class and we’d just be focusing on our breathing. Okay.

And part of that was torturous for me at 17. Um, but finding though, you know, finding those class, those classes where there’s, we’re, we’re meditating or we’re, we’re taking in the room and, and knowing why we’re doing that, we’re doing this to, uh, be grounded and, and, uh, and ready or present, or we’re doing this to connect with everyone. Um, a big thing was, uh, you know, if you’re doing an ensemble piece, um, you want to be part of the ensemble and not to, uh, not standing out on your own and that whole realization too.

So knowing why you were doing it really helped to, uh, to. Yeah. And I knew it all was, I knew I, I never didn’t want to try anything.

Um, it obviously some exercises I knew were going to be more of a struggle than others, but I, but I loved theatre and I wanted to be a performer. So, uh, I’m very goal oriented. So everything was a challenge that I wanted to tackle, whether it was being still and silent or the opposite.

Did you find that once you were in theatre school that you’d found like your people, were you in the place that you felt like you didn’t have before? Or did you find that in high school? Yeah. I found, I found it in high school. We had a great arts program.

Um, and, uh, my drama teacher, I had known her for years. She was the mother actually of my best friend growing up. Um, and she was a wonderful mentor to me and put on these, uh, big productions.

And it was a school that where the football players, all the top football players were in the musical. Oh shit. It was like, it was nice.

Yeah. Theatre theatre was definitely the coolest thing to do. Um, so it was great because I, there was no backlash for me being my myself and in that environment.

Um, and people were really accepting and inclusive and theatre school, even it just kind of enhanced from there. Right. You find people that you can sit down and have a beer with them and talk, you know, about what you love and shows that you’ve seen and how that, that striked you.

And I think it’s always great when you’re talking to another theatre person because they know the work that goes into doing all those things. You can talk about, you know, the work that you’re doing and how that inspired that. And just those, those conversations are always the best.

Yeah. Yeah. Um, a couple of times you’ve mentioned, uh, uh, when you’re able to be yourself.

Um, and are you in a place now where you, and were you like in theatre school, you were able to be yourself for the, for most of the time, or did you have to reign it in a lot? And, um, I mean, there, there’s also, I, I think theatre school for sure. I was able to, to just be me. Um, and, but there’s also that, that element of, uh, you know, what’s me and what’s my ADHD making me impulsive or hyper or, um, you know, scattered.

Um, so when I think of like sitting still or, or, or, uh, you know, medit, meditating or, or anything like that. Um, I don’t think that’s not me. I just think it’s difficult because of the way that my brain is.

Yeah. I don’t think I’m not being me when I have to do those things, especially in an art form, but, um, they’re just more challenging. Was, was finding the difference between, um, you and your ADHD, a difficult thing to do? It’s kind of a new thing for me actually.

Yeah. After, after I went back to, um, school to do educational assistance, special needs support, I, I kind of turned my focus to, uh, ADHD and to learn more about my diagnosis. And I learned, you know, about symptoms that I didn’t even know were symptoms of my ADHD.

Um, and especially about being an adult, cause it manifests differently in a child than an adult. Um, your strengths and weaknesses can even be different in, in both. So, uh, that whole experience kind of made me reflect and I’m still reflecting on that.

And I think often like, what is me and what is that? And, and because, you know, if I, if I mess up, if I forget a deadline or I miss a bus or at any time to a certain extent, I know I need to give myself a break because that’s, that’s where the ADHD is coming in and, and affecting my organizational skills. But then, you know, when, when is it not ADHD and when it’s you being lazy and not being prepared or, you know, so you kind of have to find that balance for, for you. I mean, I know I have, I have like systems in place and tools that I use to, to stay on top of things.

Um, and sometimes those fail and I no longer blame myself for that because I know there’s other things. Sure. I think a lot of people, uh, sometimes would give themselves a pass and be like, oh, well, you know, I missed the deadline because you know, ADHD and not hold themselves accountable because, you know, you deadlines are deadlines and sometimes you have, you have no choice but to make them.

Um, and so you have to find a way to do that. Um, so it can go, it can go, that’s the thing. It can go either way.

You can be like, oh, you can use like anything else. You can lose, you can use your label or your, you know, your excuse, whatever it is. You can use that, um, to, uh, you know, as an excuse for everything.

Sure. Or you can not recognize that and, uh, be way too hard on yourself for something that you cannot control. Um, I will, I, as I have a lot of, of tools and strategies that I, that I use that I’ve built, I’ve done my diagnosis at seven, like my weaknesses have been the same since I was seven.

Um, I, and I, the tools have changed obviously. Um, but I, I’ve known them since then. So I’ve had a lot of time to try and find the best system that works for me.

But I also know that I will, no matter how hard I try, I’ll never be an organized person. I’ll never have it all together. And that’s okay.

I have the strategies to get me as close to everyone else as I can. Um, but I also can’t, uh, be, uh, I can’t keep putting myself down for things that are outside of my control. As somebody who’s producing their own theatre, what’s the, what is the biggest challenge of, of, uh, aside from just organization? Yeah.

How, what is it that, what’s the challenge and how do you manage to get things done? Yeah, it’s been a bit, and I, I produced, uh, a show that I, and stage manager this year that I wasn’t in. So that, that, that was an interesting, uh, new thing. Um, cause it, it’s kind of like producing is, I mean, producing is kind of the opposite for any artist.

Like it’s, it’s a, it’s a different hat. Yes. Switch your brain.

And they don’t often teach us anything about that in theatre school. They don’t, they teach you nothing about self-producing. But, uh, I, yeah, when, when you have something that’s affecting your organizational, uh, skills and, and, you know, kind of make you more forgetful or, or distractible, um, producing is always a challenge.

And again, like you can’t, it was a new thing. When I started, I self produced Sarah, the first show. And I, it was a big learning curve.

I had a mentor that helped me through a lot of like the fringe stuff. And then going outside of that, it’s a lot of, uh, asking for help when you need it. And, and for me, I find producing, like I just take longer to do things that, that other people than, than other people, um, an application can take me like two 24 hour days.

And, uh, it’s, it’s time a lot like this year. I, because I knew I wanted to produce and write and create a lot more, I moved to Hamilton and I went down to only working a part time. So I’m, I’m full time.

I, I tallied up all my hours a month ago about how many hours I put into producing and, and, and art. And it’s like 30, anywhere between 30 and 50 hours a week. I mean, that’s, I had, I had one good moment of, Oh, I’m a full time artist.

And then, Oh my God, I’m not being paid for that. Yeah. Um, but that’s also just me taking way longer than the average person to do some of the simplest things.

And that’s part organization. That’s part like getting distracted. Like sometimes I can read a question on a, on a form and I literally read it like 15 times.

And then I’m like, Oh, okay, no, I got it. I just like, I’m sorry. I start thinking about something else while I’m reading it or, or, you know, I looking at something else and suddenly I didn’t absorb the information.

Um, and it’s like what a lot of people experience, but this is it every single time for me. To be fair, in some of those forms, the questions are not particularly straightforwardly written. It’s like a lawyer sat down and thought, well, what’s the most difficult way, but specific that I could say this.

It’s so true. While keeping it broad. Yes.

Yeah. Yeah. It’s not, it’s not always easy.

Some are definitely more difficult than others, but, uh, producing has been a huge learning curve, but I do think I have, uh, uh, somewhat handle on it now. Well, so why the move to Hamilton? Like you were in London, Niagara? Well, that’s why the move. Okay.

Okay. From well into the big city of Hamilton. Yeah.

Um, I lived in London. I went to school there and I lived there to do a show for a few months. I spent eight months in Toronto.

Yeah. I lived in, in, uh, you know, around Niagara and, uh, after doing, uh, Sarah in the Hamilton fringe, I did the Hamilton fringe alert program, which is a producing program for artists. Um, and we helped produce the 2017 frostbites festival.

And I, you know, every time we had a meeting, which was like once or twice a month, we’d all go out after, or we’d see a show together. And I kind of got to know Hamilton through doing Sarah in the fringe and then doing this program for eight months. I just fell in love with the city.

It’s so vibrant. There’s so much theatre happening. Um, last night I got to do a story with the Hamilton seven, um, which is this amazing storytelling group that does a show every month.

Um, and they’ve been all been doing it for years and some of them have traveled all over the world doing it. Um, and it was so great to be able to, to tell a story with, with, you know, such high caliber, wonderful people. Um, and the city was still having like so much going on and so many artists in the city, like every day I’m meeting someone who’s moved from somewhere to be an artist in the city, which is so cool.

Um, you know, it’s still a sense of community. You see this, you see the same people at these events and the same audience members. I do a storytelling night and people tell me that they saw me in, in fringe or, or another storytelling night.

And that’s really cool. It’s really something we don’t have in, in Toronto or some of the larger cities where it’s more pockets. Yes.

I was going to say silos, but pockets is also like people get involved with particular groups and those are the people that you, that you associate with and things like that. So it’s, I definitely see the benefit of, of, you know, being able to have a community and we have that too. Like you see, there’s, there’s companies that, that will always use the same performers, um, uh, or do the same types of shows.

And, and there’s for sure that like, like any, um, you know, city with theatre, but, um, but I do find they just have a lot going on. Like there’s the, we had the Hamil 10 festival this month, 10 minute play festival, and then the mental health theatre festival in May. And I literally see a show or go to a theatre event every week.

Um, and it’s lovely. Yeah. It’s just a great community.

So you’re, you’re doing, uh, the ADD project once again in, uh, uh, what are the cities you’re doing that in? I’m doing it in London, Edmonton, Victoria, and Vancouver. Have you done Victoria, Vancouver before? I did Vancouver last year. Okay.

Had a blast. Uh, never done Victoria. Victoria is the new one this year.

All right. Cool. And you’re doing, you’re doing the, the brand new one on not quite written yet.

Yeah. It’s getting there. It’s called, uh, it’s called scared cat.

It’s about, uh, everything that I’m afraid of, which is everything. Um, but mostly my mom. Okay.

Yeah. Um, does your mom know, know about this? No, it was kind of a, cause I, I, I obviously, uh, take a long time to write these things. Uh, like most people, I don’t think everyone’s no, no one’s done their friend show right now at this point.

Right. We saw some, you’re done. I’m redoing one that I’ve already done.

I just have to relearn it because two years, but re reoccurring doesn’t count. But, uh, I realized recently, actually I was writing, writing the show and each year my show is kind of a message. Um, and I, that just has happened organically.

And, but, but I found, I, I really liked that aspect of my work and I was writing a show and writing all these funny stories about being scared of everything as a kid, um, going into the ocean for the first time and bawling my eyes out and screaming. I was like 16. Um, and I realized though that like, there’s not like there, what’s like the message with this show.

And, and then I went back and looked at all the stories and my mom was in every single one of them and the antagonist in every single one. So I’ve, I’ve, she doesn’t know cause it was a new thing I’ve just discovered this week that, uh, the show is going to be, it’s a lot of like funny, scary kid stories, but it’s, uh, it’s definitely a mother daughter show. Do you think your mom will find it funny or, cause you, you mentioned that when you did the ADHD project the first time, like everybody stood up except your parents.

They did at the end. Okay. They’re not theatre people.

So they didn’t understand what people were doing. Okay. Okay.

How do you think your mom’s going to like, uh, being the antagonist and are you going to give her a heads up before she sees it? Um, I don’t know. I really don’t know. She like, she refused to see Sarah.

I wanted to do it in front of them like two days before I opened. Uh, just so I had, I’d done it in front of someone other than my director and she refused to because she said if she doesn’t like it or it sucks, I’ll see it on her face and then she’ll feel bad. So I wasn’t allowed to do it for my parents before I performed it.

So, I mean, she, she’s so supportive and both my parents are, are my number one fans and they come see everything. But, uh, she hates, uh, when I say that she’s going to be in some of my stories. So I don’t know how she’s going to feel about it, but she will love it.

Cause it’s me and my daughter. We’ll see how it goes. I don’t know.

I’ll probably give her a heads up that she’s in stories. I’m not going to give her a heads up that it’s about us. Cause I’m worried that she’ll be Yeah.

Yeah. Unless she listens to this. In which case, in which case cats out of the bag.

Yeah. Well, I mean, if worst comes to worst, I mean, after you perform it, you’re going to have like all kinds of extra stories about, yeah. And she reacted to this show.

There’ll be part two. Yeah. I mean, I’m performing a show like I, I know what you mean about wanting to perform it in front of people before you perform it in front of people, like a workshop.

Yeah. I, I needed to perform the commandment in front of people. I was like, who is the most receptive, who are the most receptive of my friends who will allow me to perform this.

And even if they hate it, well, not necessarily, um, show it on their face. People who are going to be like, who would be able to watch it and just be able to, to like, be supportive, be good audience members and not people who would be like, oh, suddenly go sour faced in the middle. And I’d be like, I can see you.

This is just me talking to you. Yeah. Yeah.

Is that, does this, is your mom’s reaction to this something that you worry about? Um, I mean, like I said, this isn’t, this isn’t new, like a new discovery in here. So I haven’t, I haven’t thought too much on it. I mean, it does, it does make me nervous.

Hence why I’m not positive that I’ll tell her prior to her coming. Um, uh, she’s a very private person and, and I’m not revealing a bunch of things. I, I just, I’ve wanted to talk about our, our relationship for a while because it’s very, uh, we’re complete opposites.

Um, and yet now we’re best friends because I’m my dad. So of course, you know, so, you know, we, I tell her everything. Um, but it took a long time of, you know, world war three before getting there.

And I think based off of, I mean, I get to, I mean, I do, I’m workshopping this show with, uh, the junction with your Aquarius. So I read out the stories all the time to my little, uh, writing group. Um, and just based from that, like I’m not the only one who’s had certain experiences with their mom like this.

So that kind of gives me reassurance too, that I think it’s important to sometimes talk about these, uh, awkward, I don’t know, conversations or experiences we have with our, our parents when we’re still learning that they’re actual people. Yeah. Cause it goes both ways.

Sure. On the upside, after you do it in Hamilton, you get to run away to Edmonton into the West to do, uh, to do the ADHD project for a while. So that is true.

After we go on a family vacation to our cottage. Oh shit. Okay.

So that’s, that’s maybe not quite as yeah. Yeah. No.

Okay. Well, we’ll see. We’ll see.

It’s going to be an interesting summer. It could be very interesting. Well, Carla, thank you so much for this.

It’s been a lot of fun. Yeah. Thank you.

I’m really excited to be back. This has been a homebody productions production.